I saw Bob Sapp in a commercial for pizza (I think). I don't recall him saying anything, though. Could he speak any Japanese when he was alive (as you put it, he, he)?
foreign speakers myth DEBUNKED!
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@ J.C.
LOL, it must be hard for any foreigner to be mistaken for a Japanese, unless you're from Asia or have Asian ancestry^^;;
Osaka must be a very international state or city then!
About Becky, I know she's a "haafu", lol, and that was exactly what I meant, she seems to "play" a foreign part. I thought it was interesting because, if true, it could imply that either her:
1) plays the part to somehow guarantee her place on the entertainment world;
2) acts that way because the society expects her to, or
3) acts that way because she herself wants to show she's different.
Guess it's really hard to know or tell.
Oh, I didn't know there are many Christian people in Korea!
But maybe the country was much more influenced by other countries as well, USA and such, than Japan.
LOL, it must be hard for any foreigner to be mistaken for a Japanese, unless you're from Asia or have Asian ancestry^^;;
Osaka must be a very international state or city then!
About Becky, I know she's a "haafu", lol, and that was exactly what I meant, she seems to "play" a foreign part. I thought it was interesting because, if true, it could imply that either her:
1) plays the part to somehow guarantee her place on the entertainment world;
2) acts that way because the society expects her to, or
3) acts that way because she herself wants to show she's different.
Guess it's really hard to know or tell.
Oh, I didn't know there are many Christian people in Korea!
But maybe the country was much more influenced by other countries as well, USA and such, than Japan.
@Xie
Yeah, student fees. That's actually the problem of every student wanting to study abroad =/ Either you get a scholarship or you get a loan.
Even Erasmus exchange student's scholarships (if you know that one) only cover the flight and a few months rent, depending on where you're staying.
Which languages are you interested in?
Yeah, student fees. That's actually the problem of every student wanting to study abroad =/ Either you get a scholarship or you get a loan.
Even Erasmus exchange student's scholarships (if you know that one) only cover the flight and a few months rent, depending on where you're staying.
Which languages are you interested in?
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/ERASMUS_programme
This one?
I think, possibly except Japanese and those in my country, I'm almost into European languages only. Well, I'm not sure. When I consider the awful amount of time needed for fluency in any (esp. the need of reading) and the uncertainty of doing practically anything, I just can't tell what to do in the next 2/3 years.
This one?
I think, possibly except Japanese and those in my country, I'm almost into European languages only. Well, I'm not sure. When I consider the awful amount of time needed for fluency in any (esp. the need of reading) and the uncertainty of doing practically anything, I just can't tell what to do in the next 2/3 years.
Aha, exactly, that one.
The one I know is for European students, but there seems to be another one for international students as well?
Oh, I know it's a bit different, but can you read (understand) Japanese by knowing Chinese?
Guess one of the best things of Western languages is that there's only one alphabet, so even if you don't understand everything you can still read and try to fill the blanks. My biggest problem with Japanese is precisely the fact that I can't read much in order to improve since I have to learn the kanji first...
This is a stupid question, but is there a good way to memorize them (the symbols)?
Well, you know English already, it's at least really useful on the internet even if you can't practice it in your country =D
And like you said, learning a language requires a lot of effort and motivation (not to mention resources), so you don't want to start learning a language you'll never, ever use, right?
The one I know is for European students, but there seems to be another one for international students as well?
Oh, I know it's a bit different, but can you read (understand) Japanese by knowing Chinese?
Guess one of the best things of Western languages is that there's only one alphabet, so even if you don't understand everything you can still read and try to fill the blanks. My biggest problem with Japanese is precisely the fact that I can't read much in order to improve since I have to learn the kanji first...
This is a stupid question, but is there a good way to memorize them (the symbols)?
Well, you know English already, it's at least really useful on the internet even if you can't practice it in your country =D
And like you said, learning a language requires a lot of effort and motivation (not to mention resources), so you don't want to start learning a language you'll never, ever use, right?
I have an Irish-American friend who is fluent in Japanese. (He is currently a V.P. of a Japanese company!) When he was first in Japan, one of our classmates, a Chinese girl, stopped by to see him when she was visiting Asia.
At most places they stopped at in Japan, he would address the locals in Japanese. (His accent, by the way, is quite good.) They would look at him, then turn to the Chinese girl, and start talking to HER in Japanese!
This was several years ago, so maybe things have changed.
On the other hand, when I was in Taiwan, people did not seem amazed at foreigners (i.e., Europeans and Euro-Americans) speaking Chinese. In some cases, they were even surprised (and slightly critical) if someone didn't know Mandarin! (Of course, there were many people who treated every foreigner as a walking English dictionary.)
At most places they stopped at in Japan, he would address the locals in Japanese. (His accent, by the way, is quite good.) They would look at him, then turn to the Chinese girl, and start talking to HER in Japanese!
This was several years ago, so maybe things have changed.
On the other hand, when I was in Taiwan, people did not seem amazed at foreigners (i.e., Europeans and Euro-Americans) speaking Chinese. In some cases, they were even surprised (and slightly critical) if someone didn't know Mandarin! (Of course, there were many people who treated every foreigner as a walking English dictionary.)
>>>Oh, I know it's a bit different, but can you read (understand) Japanese by knowing Chinese?
Many of us try to guess the meanings, and unsurprisingly it's often very misleading. But since we are so much exposed to Japanese products, particularly food, games ....well, and porn, dozens of Japanese words even entered our language. I think only vocab with (full) Kanji is (partially) transparent. This is roughly like English vs French, with Germanic (and grammar) words in English all in a different script.
>>Guess one of the best things of Western languages is that there's only one alphabet, so even if you don't understand everything you can still read and try to fill the blanks.
I'm always tempted to learn the Cyrillic... :D One recent thought is: what you say is largely true, for both Latin/Cyrillic-based languages, when individual letters often _just_ correspond perfectly, like Kanji and Hanzi (almost perfectly transparent to me, as I read the Remembering Kanji volumes). But since many orthographies are deep to some extent, it's very important to shadow-read texts, and imo, preferably with graded texts, to get used to the script to read it and aloud.
I think Kanji and Hanzi are just that - instead of being deep, they are not phonetic at all. But the trick is still the same. Chinesepod is one great source of shadow-reading with audios I probably wouldn't be able to find elsewhere. Mandarin self-learning courses in Chinese are certainly didactic, but are so boring that I can't call it Chinese Assimil. Unlike them, cpod does teach a lot of fun stuff, very colloquial (with a neutral accent) usage and whatnot... so, yeah, this is from the perspective of a "semi"-native who just listened to speak Mandarin at full speed within months, like how a Francophone masters Italian in 6 months. I can't really find dialogues spoken with that kind of very genuine, lively intonation in "didactic courses". That must be impossible without very deep pre-learnt knowledge, but reading any script isn't that difficult when the language has become lively enough for you - good AUDIOS are essential.
>>This is a stupid question, but is there a good way to memorize them (the symbols)?
I'd say there are multiple ways. An advanced Chinese learner of Japanese told me that Remembering Kanji isn't suitable for _me_ (but perhaps not foreigners) because the order of Kanji isn't suitable, with rarely used characters appearing quite early. Well, based on words above, I must agree that I don't really have to _learn_ Kanji except a few exceptions.
Another way is shadow-reading. I didn't memorize anything to speak Mandarin (*I've met just a few natives until now); I just listened...well, and read, since some words were neologisms in the Mainland culture. Unlike quite a few European languages, when you learn Kanji and Hanzi and their mothers, you don't have any visual clues (and all you can find are misleading). But well, I think French and English wouldn't be more difficult if they were all in Kanji/Hanzi. Words in whatever shape in whichever language is just a random, arbitrarily written combination of strokes. While phonetic words often provide meaningful visual clues (even French words are systematically formed), it's still necessary to absorb them in terms of words, chunks, whole sentences and, above all, in your idiolect.
>>>And like you said, learning a language requires a lot of effort and motivation (not to mention resources), so you don't want to start learning a language you'll never, ever use, right?
I'd love to be young Barry Farber and Ziad Fazah... yes, now my concern is no longer about how but why and when. To save time, I'd allow myself to take a glance at a heavily declined language (which is Russian) just for fun of it after German and French, so that I'd know something about their 3 families.
==
I still find shadowing a central activity. How wonderful it would be for my foreign professors to speak Chinese and me to speak foreign tongues with a perfect accent, as long as that wouldn't harm you personally. Faking identities could be dangerous, but I don't think it could happen normally with Chinese.
Many of us try to guess the meanings, and unsurprisingly it's often very misleading. But since we are so much exposed to Japanese products, particularly food, games ....well, and porn, dozens of Japanese words even entered our language. I think only vocab with (full) Kanji is (partially) transparent. This is roughly like English vs French, with Germanic (and grammar) words in English all in a different script.
>>Guess one of the best things of Western languages is that there's only one alphabet, so even if you don't understand everything you can still read and try to fill the blanks.
I'm always tempted to learn the Cyrillic... :D One recent thought is: what you say is largely true, for both Latin/Cyrillic-based languages, when individual letters often _just_ correspond perfectly, like Kanji and Hanzi (almost perfectly transparent to me, as I read the Remembering Kanji volumes). But since many orthographies are deep to some extent, it's very important to shadow-read texts, and imo, preferably with graded texts, to get used to the script to read it and aloud.
I think Kanji and Hanzi are just that - instead of being deep, they are not phonetic at all. But the trick is still the same. Chinesepod is one great source of shadow-reading with audios I probably wouldn't be able to find elsewhere. Mandarin self-learning courses in Chinese are certainly didactic, but are so boring that I can't call it Chinese Assimil. Unlike them, cpod does teach a lot of fun stuff, very colloquial (with a neutral accent) usage and whatnot... so, yeah, this is from the perspective of a "semi"-native who just listened to speak Mandarin at full speed within months, like how a Francophone masters Italian in 6 months. I can't really find dialogues spoken with that kind of very genuine, lively intonation in "didactic courses". That must be impossible without very deep pre-learnt knowledge, but reading any script isn't that difficult when the language has become lively enough for you - good AUDIOS are essential.
>>This is a stupid question, but is there a good way to memorize them (the symbols)?
I'd say there are multiple ways. An advanced Chinese learner of Japanese told me that Remembering Kanji isn't suitable for _me_ (but perhaps not foreigners) because the order of Kanji isn't suitable, with rarely used characters appearing quite early. Well, based on words above, I must agree that I don't really have to _learn_ Kanji except a few exceptions.
Another way is shadow-reading. I didn't memorize anything to speak Mandarin (*I've met just a few natives until now); I just listened...well, and read, since some words were neologisms in the Mainland culture. Unlike quite a few European languages, when you learn Kanji and Hanzi and their mothers, you don't have any visual clues (and all you can find are misleading). But well, I think French and English wouldn't be more difficult if they were all in Kanji/Hanzi. Words in whatever shape in whichever language is just a random, arbitrarily written combination of strokes. While phonetic words often provide meaningful visual clues (even French words are systematically formed), it's still necessary to absorb them in terms of words, chunks, whole sentences and, above all, in your idiolect.
>>>And like you said, learning a language requires a lot of effort and motivation (not to mention resources), so you don't want to start learning a language you'll never, ever use, right?
I'd love to be young Barry Farber and Ziad Fazah... yes, now my concern is no longer about how but why and when. To save time, I'd allow myself to take a glance at a heavily declined language (which is Russian) just for fun of it after German and French, so that I'd know something about their 3 families.
==
I still find shadowing a central activity. How wonderful it would be for my foreign professors to speak Chinese and me to speak foreign tongues with a perfect accent, as long as that wouldn't harm you personally. Faking identities could be dangerous, but I don't think it could happen normally with Chinese.
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