CringeFest 7: I don't have an accent

>> The main thing, though, is that "soda" has been standardized upon in more prestige varieties spoken in English-speaking North America, even though most GA-like dialects in reality would use "pop" rather than "soda". <<

I don't believe you. Are you trying to say that "soda" is more prestigious than "pop"?

It's funny how in the West, California and Arizona are so strongly differentiated from other areas. They are soda drinkers, whereas the rest of the West prefers other terms--and this changes almost right at the state borders. That's really weird.

>>I don't believe you. Are you trying to say that "soda" is more prestigious than "pop"?<<

Yes. If you don't believe me, just look at what word they generally use for such in media content - "soda" is practically always used unless there is a deliberate effort to add some "local color" of one sort or another.

>> Yes. If you don't believe me, just look at what word they generally use for such in media content - "soda" is practically always used unless there is a deliberate effort to add some "local color" of one sort or another. <<

No. "Soda pop" or soft drink are the more formal forms. Plain "soda" adds just as much "local color" as "pop". Although around here, both soda and pop are used frequently.

>>No. "Soda pop" or soft drink are the more formal forms. Plain "soda" adds just as much "local color" as "pop". Although around here, both soda and pop are used frequently.<<

I would say that the most formal term for such would be "soft drink", with "soda pop" being already somewhat antiquated. But in most commonplace usage in media content, "soda" is the word that is by far most heavily used for such. And if "soda" adds any local color, well, it is no more than most American TV shows and like today being set either in California or the Northeast...

>> "soda pop" being already somewhat antiquated. <<

Brittney Spears has a song called "Soda Pop". But I guess she is pretty antiquated by now.

"Kicked into touch", Damian? What does that mean?

>> While there are a few features of such that would sound generally accented, such as the use of /in/ for "-ing" <<

Other than that, are there other features that would sound accented? I tend to doubt it. From what I've read, it looks like the two dialects are practically the same: /o/ is conservative in both; /u/ is also conservative in most positions; both have /{g/ raising, some Canadian raising, and the treatment of pre-rhotic vowels are practically the same. And both either merge or shift /O/ to [A]. Neither participate strongly in the CVS or NCVS.

>>>> While there are a few features of such that would sound generally accented, such as the use of /in/ for "-ing" <<

Other than that, are there other features that would sound accented? I tend to doubt it. From what I've read, it looks like the two dialects are practically the same: /o/ is conservative in both; /u/ is also conservative in most positions; both have /{g/ raising, some Canadian raising, and the treatment of pre-rhotic vowels are practically the same. And both either merge or shift /O/ to [A]. Neither participate strongly in the CVS or NCVS.<<

I am not sure you remember that what are being compared and contrasted here are the English spoken in Seattle and *conservative* GA. The matter with conservative GA is that it retains distinctions that have been lost in most modern NAE dialects overall, and it still retains the old phonemic vowel length system whereas most dialects spoken today away from the eastern seaboard have discarded phonemic vowel length. The retention of historical phonemic vowel length is a key factor here that is often forgotten, as if gives conservative GA a distinctly different cadence than most modern non-eastern NAE dialects. Also, conservative GA retains the distinctions between /w/ and /ʍ/ and between /ær/ and unmerged or merged /ɛr/ and /eːr/, which distinguishes it from many modern GA-like dialects and makes it sound more accented in contrast to them. (And, of course, conservative GA does not have /æg/, /æŋ/, or /ɛŋ/ raising, does not merge or shift historical /ɔː/ to [ɑ(ː)], and does not have [o] but rather [oʊ̯] in non-pre-rhotic environments, which makes me wonder just what you are trying to compare Seattle English with.)

Uriel:

"Kicked into touch" simply means being dismissed as either irrelevant or unworthy of any further consideration.....I would think it's the same as saying "kicked to the kerb", or is it "curb" in your book? It's a football (soccer) or Rugby football term here in the UK....kicking the ball into touch means kicking it over the boundary line of the pitch (the playing area) and therefore making it a "dead" ball, no longer in play.

The outward edge of a pavement here in the UK is called the kerb. THe outward edge of a sidewalk in the USA is called the curb. Am I right?

To us, curb means to limit the effect of something, to clip one's wings, or to hold back from saying something offensive or aggressive by curbing the tongue and therefore saving yourself from likely regret.

>>The outward edge of a pavement here in the UK is called the kerb. THe outward edge of a sidewalk in the USA is called the curb. Am I right<<

In at least North American English, the term "curb" denotes the raised edge or lip on a side of a road rather than the edge of some section of pavement in general.

I don't think anyone here in the UK uses the word "pop" on its own to mean a drink - at least not here in Scotland, anyway - but an "alcopop" is different. Alcopops are a great bone of contention to many people here in the UK hoping to curb (see...that word again) the incidence of binge drinking, especially among under age people - 18 is the minimum legal drinking age here which is flouted left right and centre anyway.

Pop itself usually means a sound - like tht when you pull a cork out of a bottle of Krug or something fizzy. You ears can go pop when there is a sudden change in air pressure.

You can even pop a weasel......read all about popping weasels....something to do with old Cockney slang from London and not much to do with cruelty to wee furry animals with cute beady eyes and very sharp teeth...or is that mink?

Half a pound of tuppency rice
Half a pound of treacle
That's the way the money goes -
Pop goes the weasel
Up and down the City Road
In and out The Eagle
That's the way the money goes
Pop goes the weasel

http://www.rhymes.org.uk/a116-pop-goes-the-weasel.htm

>> 18 is the minimum legal drinking age here which is flouted left right and centre anyway. <<

Wow, the drinking age is really only 18 there? I can't believe they let kids drink and go to pubs. In America the drinking age is 21, which I think is much more sensible. Also, the word "pop" here refers to a drink such as Coca-Cola or Sprite-- never to alcoholic beverages.

>> which makes me wonder just what you are trying to compare Seattle English with.) <<

Ah, you misunderstood. I was referring to the difference between Seattle and Milwaukee English, which to me looks very minimal. I doubt whether speakers from those places would be able to pick out each others accents, or even notice them--barring the trained linguist like yourself.

>> he matter with conservative GA is that it retains distinctions that have been lost in most modern NAE dialects overall, and it still retains the old phonemic vowel length system whereas most dialects spoken today away from the eastern seaboard have discarded phonemic vowel length. <<

Hmm. What vowel length is this? I thought NAE had allophonic vowel length.