In this case you are referring to a specific vowel phoneme split, known as the trap-bath split, where, yes, the innovative cases are primarily southern English English dialects and southern hemisphere English dialects, along with some dialects in the northeast of the US as well.
american or british
<<That depends upon which words you are referring to. With some words pronunciation can be broken up more easily into other groups. For example, Northern English and North Americans use what is sometimes referred to as "conservative pronunciation" as it maintains the original pronunciation. People in the South East, Australia and NZ use what is sometimes known as "innovative pronunciation"; the name reflects the change which started to occur about 300 years ago but has been incomplete in its deployment.
The following words, for example rhyme in conservative pronunciation, but not in innovative pronunciation:
glass......gas
answer....cancer
pass.......mass
path.......maths
castle......tassel
disaster....aster
last....elastic>>
Yes, those words rhyme for the vast majority of North Americans, as we too follow the old pattern there. When North America was colonized by the British the pronunciations used for those words were pretty much the same as we have today in the US and Canada, while current Southern British usage follows a more innovative pattern which came around a couple centuries after North American colonization. If the Antipodes had been colonized at the time North America was it's likely they'd follow the old pattern, too.
Of course, it's very debatable whether or not a dialect is "better" because certain features are more conservative. Also, every dialect has some conservative and innovative features. North American English is conservative in preserving full rhoticity and the general lack of the "trap-bath" split but is innovative with its different groupings of vowel mergers. Southern British English is innovative in having lost rhoticity and developed the "trap-bath" split but is conservative in preserving some vowel distinctions (such as the lack of the "father-bother" merger) which almost all (but not quite all) North Americans have merged.
The following words, for example rhyme in conservative pronunciation, but not in innovative pronunciation:
glass......gas
answer....cancer
pass.......mass
path.......maths
castle......tassel
disaster....aster
last....elastic>>
Yes, those words rhyme for the vast majority of North Americans, as we too follow the old pattern there. When North America was colonized by the British the pronunciations used for those words were pretty much the same as we have today in the US and Canada, while current Southern British usage follows a more innovative pattern which came around a couple centuries after North American colonization. If the Antipodes had been colonized at the time North America was it's likely they'd follow the old pattern, too.
Of course, it's very debatable whether or not a dialect is "better" because certain features are more conservative. Also, every dialect has some conservative and innovative features. North American English is conservative in preserving full rhoticity and the general lack of the "trap-bath" split but is innovative with its different groupings of vowel mergers. Southern British English is innovative in having lost rhoticity and developed the "trap-bath" split but is conservative in preserving some vowel distinctions (such as the lack of the "father-bother" merger) which almost all (but not quite all) North Americans have merged.
All those words rhyme for me, ill have to listen to some southeners to see whether they don't
<<"Yes, but most of their dialects sound awful because they underpronounce their r's." I agree, that's why I prefer the American English!>>
That's just like saying that the "k" in "knight" or "know" should be pronounced (lest you "underpronounce"). Spelling and pronunciation have, in English at least, precious little in common and purists who advocate that "words should be pronounced as they're spelt" know little or nothing about the history of English phonology.
That's just like saying that the "k" in "knight" or "know" should be pronounced (lest you "underpronounce"). Spelling and pronunciation have, in English at least, precious little in common and purists who advocate that "words should be pronounced as they're spelt" know little or nothing about the history of English phonology.
<That depends upon which words you are referring to. With some words pronunciation can be broken up more easily into other groups. For example, Northern English and North Americans use what is sometimes referred to as "conservative pronunciation" as it maintains the original pronunciation. People in the South East, Australia and NZ use what is sometimes known as "innovative pronunciation"; the name reflects the change which started to occur about 300 years ago but has been incomplete in its deployment.
The following words, for example rhyme in conservative pronunciation, but not in innovative pronunciation:
glass......gas
answer....cancer
pass.......mass
path.......maths
castle......tassel
disaster....aster
last....elastic
Australians actually pronounce glass as glahss, answer and cancer the same as NAs; we pronounce pass as pahss, but we do not rhyme mass with pass, castle with tassel, or disaster with aster, and we use a really short A in "elastic" of which a Yorkshireman would be proud.
Northern English and North American pronunciation are worlds apart.
The following words, for example rhyme in conservative pronunciation, but not in innovative pronunciation:
glass......gas
answer....cancer
pass.......mass
path.......maths
castle......tassel
disaster....aster
last....elastic
Australians actually pronounce glass as glahss, answer and cancer the same as NAs; we pronounce pass as pahss, but we do not rhyme mass with pass, castle with tassel, or disaster with aster, and we use a really short A in "elastic" of which a Yorkshireman would be proud.
Northern English and North American pronunciation are worlds apart.
Are the terms like "copybook", "exercise book" or "rough book" used in AmE?
>>but we do not rhyme mass with pass, castle with tassel,<<
You probably do rhyme castle with tassel and hassle if you're Victorian.
You probably do rhyme castle with tassel and hassle if you're Victorian.
Im asking for the third time, are the words ""copybook", "exercise book" or "rough book" used in AmE?
>>Im asking for the third time, are the words ""copybook", "exercise book" or "rough book" used in AmE?<<
I myself am not familiar with the terms, but that's me.
I myself am not familiar with the terms, but that's me.
In answer to Travis: AmE would use "notebook". I'm familiar with the term "he blotted his copybook" meaning "he messed up and got caught," but as a former English major I read a lot of Brit Lit.
So why is the New Jersey turnpike so famous?
I'd like to also add to George's list. The Turnpike is also featured in the opening credits of The Sopranos. You know, where he's driving through the toll gate, and there are screen shots of chemical plants and that ugly brown bridge (the Pulaski Skyway). That's the worst part of the NJ Turnpike, right around Exit 13 - Elizabeth.
I'd like to also add to George's list. The Turnpike is also featured in the opening credits of The Sopranos. You know, where he's driving through the toll gate, and there are screen shots of chemical plants and that ugly brown bridge (the Pulaski Skyway). That's the worst part of the NJ Turnpike, right around Exit 13 - Elizabeth.
>>In answer to Travis: AmE would use "notebook". I'm familiar with the term "he blotted his copybook" meaning "he messed up and got caught," but as a former English major I read a lot of Brit Lit.<<
The reason why I had given that answer is that I did not know what the English English terms referred to in the first place, and whether or not such terms just had North American English meanings which I was not aware of, so it was hard to give a specific answer in the first place.
The reason why I had given that answer is that I did not know what the English English terms referred to in the first place, and whether or not such terms just had North American English meanings which I was not aware of, so it was hard to give a specific answer in the first place.
***As a former English major I read a lot of Brit Lit***
Good for you....Brit Lit is cool. I'd love to know your faves, Susan. It's always great to compare TV/film interpretations of some of the great classics with the authors' originals. They'd probably spin in their tombs if they were so see the liberties taken.
Regarding the other issue, "notebook" is the most commonly used here. I don't think I've ever heard anyone use "copybook"...it sounds Victorian somhow.
The "blotted her/his copybook" is used over here in Brit Lit land as well....just ask Patricia Hewitt, Charles Clarke and John Prescott.....all current c/b blotters in this country at the minute.
Good for you....Brit Lit is cool. I'd love to know your faves, Susan. It's always great to compare TV/film interpretations of some of the great classics with the authors' originals. They'd probably spin in their tombs if they were so see the liberties taken.
Regarding the other issue, "notebook" is the most commonly used here. I don't think I've ever heard anyone use "copybook"...it sounds Victorian somhow.
The "blotted her/his copybook" is used over here in Brit Lit land as well....just ask Patricia Hewitt, Charles Clarke and John Prescott.....all current c/b blotters in this country at the minute.
Copybook, exercise-book, notebook: different words for different things.
It's a matter of age, knowledge and learning, not one of nationality.
It's a matter of age, knowledge and learning, not one of nationality.