The languages of Belgium

I've recently taken a greater interest in Belgium. At one time, I always thought that Flemish was a distinct language. But I have since learned that it is Dutch, or at least that Dutch is spoken in the Flemish sector of the country. Does that mean that Flemish is almost extinct?

The south, which contains about a little more than 1/3 of the population, speaks French, while 40% of the population can also speak Walloon, which is part of the Romance subfamily of langue d'oil. It is not without significant Germanic borrowing. It is about as much of a Romance Language as English is a Germanic language.

Can Belgium, even French speaking Belgium, really be called a Latin country? The Belgae who were ancient Celts of northern Gaul, were described as being the least civilized, and most closely related to the Germans on the other side of the Rhine, out of all the peoples of Gaul, which also included the Aquitani and the people of Celtica. The land that is now Belgium was never as fully Romanized as Central and southern Gaul, and was later heavily colonized by the Franks. There is not much of a Latin element left in most parts of the country.

Has anyone ever heard Walloon or Flemish Dutch?

Belgium today is essentially about 57% Dutch-speaking (in Flanders), about 40% French-speaking (in Wallonia and Brussels) and about 3% German-speaking in the East.

However, I do NOT see a great difference between the Flemish and the Walloons as people, apart from the language. They're all Belgians, whether they like it or not. ^_- Apparently only 3% of marriages in Belgium are between the two communities.

(I'm a Belgofile, by the way. When I had to introduce myself to the French exchange students at school, I said: « à l'avenir, je voudrais devenir Belge. »)

The Flemish people, who live in Flanders, have always spoken Dutch. There never was a Flemish language in the first place. There are dialects called Flemish in Belgium though, but those are West and East Flemish, and they are not the dominant dialects in Belgium, which Brabantic is.

Then on to your claims about the Walloon language. The majority of the Francophone Belgians speak Belgian French, which barely differs from regular French.You say 40% of the population speaks Walloon ... which is totally ridiculous.Walloon is spoken by about 500,000 people. Also, the language does have Germanic influences, but they are by no means comparable to the English situation in any way.

Belgium is somewhere on the dividing ligne between Latin Europe and Germanic Europe Like Switzerland, Luxembourg; Alsace or Italian Tyrol.
So its culture is mixed, at least linguistically. It is not without reasons that the capitals of the European union are Brussels, Luxembourg and Strasbourg.

On what do you base these claims for linguistic mixing? You're essentially saying people speak creoles in those areas. Which, for the record, is nonsense.

Sander said, "You say 40% of the population speaks Walloon ... which is totally ridiculous.Walloon is spoken by about 500,000 people."

<<Walloon was the predominant language of the Walloon people until the beginning of the 20th century, even though they had a passive knowledge of French. Since that time, the use of French has spread to the extent that now only 30-40% of the Walloon population speak their ancestral language. Breaking the statistics down by age, 70-80% of the population aged over 60 speak Walloon, while only about 10% of those under 30 do so. Passive knowledge of Walloon is much more widespread: claimed by some 36-58% of the younger age bracket.>>

<sigh>

Total Belgian population:
10,379,067 (July 2006 est.)

Languages:
Dutch (Official) 60%, French (Official) 40%, German (Official) <1%

Francophones:
4,151,626

This means that the total (according to wikipedia) of 600,000 Walloon speakers, is no more than 14,45 %

AND NOT 40%.

I have to agree with Sander — the idea of 40% of Belgians speaking Walloon simply doesn't measure up to reality.

It is possible however that a large number of Francophones from Belgium can *understand* Walloon though. Heck, I can understand it in the written form (I've never heard it so I don't know about the spoken form).

I got the information from Wikipedia!
<<Walloon was the predominant language of the Walloon people until the beginning of the 20th century, even though they had a passive knowledge of French. Since that time, the use of French has spread to the extent that now only 30-40% of the Walloon population speak their ancestral language. Breaking the statistics down by age, 70-80% of the population aged over 60 speak Walloon, while only about 10% of those under 30 do so. Passive knowledge of Walloon is much more widespread: claimed by some 36-58% of the younger age bracket.>>

You initially claimed that 40% of *Belgians* could speak Walloon. Although 30-40% of Walloons speaking Walloon is an extremely liberal estimate, it's certainly more realistic than your original assertion.

It wasn't my assertion. It was directly from Wikipedia.

He, you posted it here that means you 're responsible for the information, not wikipedia.

Well, according to THIS Wikipedia page, speakers of Walloon number about 600,000:
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Walloon_language
For the record, that might be about 15% of Walloons and about 6% of Belgians.

Statistics regarding minority languages are always controversial though because the people who collect them often have a particular agenda. Take Ireland, for example. I've seen statistics which claim that 25% of people in Ireland speak Irish — the sort of statistics that sentimental so-called Irish-Americans like to quote in order to claim that millions of Irish people are actually speaking Irish on a daily basis. But actually, that number is the percentage of people who can at least hold a basic conversation in Irish; very few of them can really 'speak' it as the language is not used in public daily life, except for maybe in a few villages on the eastern coast.

"Walloon was the predominant language of the Walloon people until the beginning of the 20th century, eventhough they had a passive knowledge of French. Since that time, the use of French has spread to the extent that now only 15% of the Walloon population speak their ancestral language. Breaking the statistics down by age, 70-80% of the population aged over 60 speak Walloon, while only about 10% of those under 30 do so. Passive knowledge of Walloon is much more widespread: claimed by some 36-58% of the younger age bracket." - Wikipedia

"Walloon was the predominant language of the Walloon people until the beginning of the 20th century, even though they had a passive knowledge of French. Since that time, the use of French has spread to the extent that now only 30-40% of the Walloon population speak their ancestral language. Breaking the statistics down by age, 70-80% of the population aged over 60 speak Walloon, while only about 10% of those under 30 do so. Passive knowledge of Walloon is much more widespread: claimed by some 36-58% of the younger age bracket." - Wikipedia

Fab said: "So its culture is mixed, at least linguistically."

Sander said: "On what do you base these claims for linguistic mixing? You're essentially saying people speak creoles in those areas. Which, for the record, is nonsense."

I don't think that Fab implied that at all.