To the original question, the conclusion seems to point to Celtic, Anglo-Saxon, AND a mixture of both.
What else did you expect?
What else did you expect?
To the English people here: Celtic or Anglo-Saxon bloodline?
"To the original question, the conclusion seems to point to Celtic, Anglo-Saxon, AND a mixture of both."
There is also a strong pre-Celtic element to the English population, what could be called the "Atlantic culture," the culture that was spread across Western Europe before the speakers of Celtic languages even arrived from the Indo-European homeland.
There is also a strong pre-Celtic element to the English population, what could be called the "Atlantic culture," the culture that was spread across Western Europe before the speakers of Celtic languages even arrived from the Indo-European homeland.
That's very interesting, Damian. I wondered if I looked like an ancient Anglo-saxon. Although at a young age, it must be noted, I had blue eyes.
I think most likely I am of Viking descent, despite my ancestors coming from the west midlands (mostly untouched by vikings); my sister has perfect blond hair.
I think most likely I am of Viking descent, despite my ancestors coming from the west midlands (mostly untouched by vikings); my sister has perfect blond hair.
***Western Europe before the speakers of Celtic languages even arrived from the Indo-European homeland***
That is very true - and this appears to be particularly evident in Welsh people, and their accent. Many people think there is a clear resemblance between some of the accents of Wales and that of people from the Indian Sub Continent. It's even joked about by comedians - well, those who are neither Welsh nor Indian anyway! :-)
There is this film (a comedy film called Privates on Parade - all about a wacky troupe of British Army personnel forming part of a unit of official entertainers out in WW2 Far East jungle battle front or something like that trying to make life bearable for the military forces out there).
Along with John Cleese, who played the part of the very "posh" English English type officer, there was Nicola Paget, a "posh" English English actress who played the part of a girl from Wales. The closest to a Welsh accent she could muster sounded exactly like that of a British person trying to mimic an Indian accent. To most people there seemed to be no difference at all - it could well have been a lassie from Merthyr Tydfil or one from Bangalore to hear Nicola Paget's interpretation of a "Welsh" accent, but she is English after all, born of English parentage. The fact that she was born in Cairo is solely do to her mother being there at the time.
Aidan: Firstly, I like your Scottish surname! As for the West Midlands - Vikings are really and truly thin on the ground around there. You'd be well out of place down there and that's for sure - it's virtually a mini "Sub Continent" all of its own!
That is very true - and this appears to be particularly evident in Welsh people, and their accent. Many people think there is a clear resemblance between some of the accents of Wales and that of people from the Indian Sub Continent. It's even joked about by comedians - well, those who are neither Welsh nor Indian anyway! :-)
There is this film (a comedy film called Privates on Parade - all about a wacky troupe of British Army personnel forming part of a unit of official entertainers out in WW2 Far East jungle battle front or something like that trying to make life bearable for the military forces out there).
Along with John Cleese, who played the part of the very "posh" English English type officer, there was Nicola Paget, a "posh" English English actress who played the part of a girl from Wales. The closest to a Welsh accent she could muster sounded exactly like that of a British person trying to mimic an Indian accent. To most people there seemed to be no difference at all - it could well have been a lassie from Merthyr Tydfil or one from Bangalore to hear Nicola Paget's interpretation of a "Welsh" accent, but she is English after all, born of English parentage. The fact that she was born in Cairo is solely do to her mother being there at the time.
Aidan: Firstly, I like your Scottish surname! As for the West Midlands - Vikings are really and truly thin on the ground around there. You'd be well out of place down there and that's for sure - it's virtually a mini "Sub Continent" all of its own!
<<There is also a strong pre-Celtic element to the English population, what could be called the "Atlantic culture," the culture that was spread across Western Europe before the speakers of Celtic languages even arrived from the Indo-European homeland. >>
This pre-Celtic strain possibly from N. Africa via Iberia was largely already *in* the Celtic by the time the Anglo-Saxons arrived. They had been assimilated much earlier.
<<That's very interesting, Damian. I wondered if I looked like an ancient Anglo-saxon. Although at a young age, it must be noted, I had blue eyes.
I think most likely I am of Viking descent, despite my ancestors coming from the west midlands (mostly untouched by vikings); my sister has perfect blond hair. >>
Well Aidan, just because you're eyes were blue, or your sister has fair hair does not necessarily designate Nordic (Scandinavian) ancestry. Scandinavians are not the only people who have blond hair, blue eyes and tall stature, nor are the the 'originators' of such traits--they don't 'own' them either : ). It only happens to be that the percentage of those traits are high in them and the neighboring Finns, that's all. Many Scandinaians also have dark hair and darker eyes and are short.
Blond hair and blue eyes are also endemic traits of Celtic peoples, so you very well could have simply inherited them from Celtic ancestors : )
This pre-Celtic strain possibly from N. Africa via Iberia was largely already *in* the Celtic by the time the Anglo-Saxons arrived. They had been assimilated much earlier.
<<That's very interesting, Damian. I wondered if I looked like an ancient Anglo-saxon. Although at a young age, it must be noted, I had blue eyes.
I think most likely I am of Viking descent, despite my ancestors coming from the west midlands (mostly untouched by vikings); my sister has perfect blond hair. >>
Well Aidan, just because you're eyes were blue, or your sister has fair hair does not necessarily designate Nordic (Scandinavian) ancestry. Scandinavians are not the only people who have blond hair, blue eyes and tall stature, nor are the the 'originators' of such traits--they don't 'own' them either : ). It only happens to be that the percentage of those traits are high in them and the neighboring Finns, that's all. Many Scandinaians also have dark hair and darker eyes and are short.
Blond hair and blue eyes are also endemic traits of Celtic peoples, so you very well could have simply inherited them from Celtic ancestors : )
I agree with guest and I agree with the following:
"There is also a strong pre-Celtic element to the English population"
The English are surely not known for being a nation with lots of blond-haired people!
"There is also a strong pre-Celtic element to the English population"
The English are surely not known for being a nation with lots of blond-haired people!
***The English are surely not known for being a nation with lots of blond-haired people!**
Very true - nobody has suggested they were! The English are now very much a multi cultural lot - they now come in all shapes and sizes and colours - and hair colours - and, of course, accents! A fair number have no hair at all, anyway, or none to speak of. That includes a lot of younger guys who shave their heads as soon as the hair grows out again, so any hair colour is immaterial. I just can't bring myself to cut off my own blond locks! Blond Scots are not exactly two a penny either!
Very true - nobody has suggested they were! The English are now very much a multi cultural lot - they now come in all shapes and sizes and colours - and hair colours - and, of course, accents! A fair number have no hair at all, anyway, or none to speak of. That includes a lot of younger guys who shave their heads as soon as the hair grows out again, so any hair colour is immaterial. I just can't bring myself to cut off my own blond locks! Blond Scots are not exactly two a penny either!
That is true. I'm not really sure about what descent I am. Probably just a mix. Having features like that certainly does not prove nordic descent, it is only a hunch.
Thanks, Damian. My scottish surname is a bit of a misleader though.
What's up with the West Midlands?
Thanks, Damian. My scottish surname is a bit of a misleader though.
What's up with the West Midlands?
Aidan asks "what's up with the West Midlands?"
Nothing's "up with the West Midlands" that should cause you to panic in any way! :-) I was merely commenting on it's very wide mix of cultures and racial backgrounds as a result of immigration from outside of Europe, (in the case of the West Midlands largely Asian or Caribbean) like a fair number of districts in Birmingham and the West Midlands Metropolitan area generally. Now, like most other parts of the UK, it has its share of immigrants from inside Europe, too - citizens of the former Communist bloc Eastern countries taking advantage of their new found EU status giving them the virtually "automatic" right of entry to this country - so long as they are able to support themselves financially.
Check out the statistics for one of Birmingham's Parliamentary constituences: Birmingham Ladywood.
http://ukpollingreport.co.uk/guide/seat-profiles/birminghamladywood
Nothing's "up with the West Midlands" that should cause you to panic in any way! :-) I was merely commenting on it's very wide mix of cultures and racial backgrounds as a result of immigration from outside of Europe, (in the case of the West Midlands largely Asian or Caribbean) like a fair number of districts in Birmingham and the West Midlands Metropolitan area generally. Now, like most other parts of the UK, it has its share of immigrants from inside Europe, too - citizens of the former Communist bloc Eastern countries taking advantage of their new found EU status giving them the virtually "automatic" right of entry to this country - so long as they are able to support themselves financially.
Check out the statistics for one of Birmingham's Parliamentary constituences: Birmingham Ladywood.
http://ukpollingreport.co.uk/guide/seat-profiles/birminghamladywood
Birmingham Ladywood -- that's a town? Good lord, who names these places?!!
Uriel: Ladywood is a district of the city of Birmingham, and Birmingham Ladywood is the name given to the Parliamentary constituency covering that area - ie a voting area for electoral purposes. The whole of the UK is divided into over 650 such constituencies, each containing an average of about 70,000 registered voters, ie people of 18 and over qualified to register as voters in all elections of whatever kind. My own home constituency is Edinburgh West......so pretty boring compared with Ladywood. At least we do have one called Edinburgh North and Leith, but that's not as interesting as a lot of them across the country:
South Holland and The Deepings (that's in Lincolnshire)
Hackney North and Stoke Newington (London)
Basildon and Billericay (in Essex - and Billericay is pronounced something like BILL-urr-ickey - Pub Lunch knows where that is...)
Bethnal Green and Bow (where the bells come from, in East London)
Caithness, Sutherland and Easter Ross (in the very north of mainland Scotland - where John o'Groats is located)
Bognor Regis and Littlehampton (on the Sussex coast of S England)
East Kilbride, Strathaven and Lesmahagow (just outside of Glasgow)
Washington and Sunderland West (and yes, the Washington part IS connected with the United States - that's the original Washington where the American connection comes from)
Cumbernauld, Kilsyth and Kirkintilloch West (in Central Scotland)
At least Birmingham doesn't rely on boring old Souths, Wests, Easts and Norths to name its constituencies. Apart from Ladywood they have Selly Oak, Perry Bar, Northwood, Hodge Hill, Yardley, Hall Green, Edgbaston and Erdington.
Wales has a mouthful with Meirionnydd Nant Conwy, Ceredigion (pronounced KERRY-dig-yon) and Merthyr Tydfil and Rhymney (you work out the pronunciation of those as best you can!)
The constituency covering the predominantly Gaelic speaking Western Isles (those islands right in the extreme north west of Scotland) has a 100% Gaelic name - Na h-Eileanan an Iar - which is simply Gaelic for Western Isles! It's a lot easier to pronounce than it looks!
South Holland and The Deepings (that's in Lincolnshire)
Hackney North and Stoke Newington (London)
Basildon and Billericay (in Essex - and Billericay is pronounced something like BILL-urr-ickey - Pub Lunch knows where that is...)
Bethnal Green and Bow (where the bells come from, in East London)
Caithness, Sutherland and Easter Ross (in the very north of mainland Scotland - where John o'Groats is located)
Bognor Regis and Littlehampton (on the Sussex coast of S England)
East Kilbride, Strathaven and Lesmahagow (just outside of Glasgow)
Washington and Sunderland West (and yes, the Washington part IS connected with the United States - that's the original Washington where the American connection comes from)
Cumbernauld, Kilsyth and Kirkintilloch West (in Central Scotland)
At least Birmingham doesn't rely on boring old Souths, Wests, Easts and Norths to name its constituencies. Apart from Ladywood they have Selly Oak, Perry Bar, Northwood, Hodge Hill, Yardley, Hall Green, Edgbaston and Erdington.
Wales has a mouthful with Meirionnydd Nant Conwy, Ceredigion (pronounced KERRY-dig-yon) and Merthyr Tydfil and Rhymney (you work out the pronunciation of those as best you can!)
The constituency covering the predominantly Gaelic speaking Western Isles (those islands right in the extreme north west of Scotland) has a 100% Gaelic name - Na h-Eileanan an Iar - which is simply Gaelic for Western Isles! It's a lot easier to pronounce than it looks!
<<Ladywood is a district of the city of Birmingham, and Birmingham Ladywood is the name given to the Parliamentary constituency covering that area - ie a voting area for electoral purposes. The whole of the UK is divided into over 650 such constituencies, each containing an average of about 70,000 registered voters, ie people of 18 and over qualified to register as voters in all elections of whatever kind. >>
Eek. I think we just number ours. You get to have that congressman from District 10.
<<South Holland and The Deepings (that's in Lincolnshire)
Hackney North and Stoke Newington (London)
Basildon and Billericay (in Essex - and Billericay is pronounced something like BILL-urr-ickey - Pub Lunch knows where that is...) >>
The Deepings? (!!!!) Love it!
I think, deep down, ya'll just like funny names. ;) And where is the Pubster lately? I've seen his name on a few posts here and there, but the boy is seriously slacking off!
<<Washington and Sunderland West (and yes, the Washington part IS connected with the United States - that's the original Washington where the American connection comes from) >>
Yeah, and his original English family crest had -- guess what? -- some stars and stripes on it. Formed the loose basis of the flag (which of course has been modified further over the years).
<<There is this film (a comedy film called Privates on Parade - all about a wacky troupe of British Army personnel>>
Somehow, "Privates On Parade" didn't immediately conjure up a military image for me. Although they were standing at attention.....
Eek. I think we just number ours. You get to have that congressman from District 10.
<<South Holland and The Deepings (that's in Lincolnshire)
Hackney North and Stoke Newington (London)
Basildon and Billericay (in Essex - and Billericay is pronounced something like BILL-urr-ickey - Pub Lunch knows where that is...) >>
The Deepings? (!!!!) Love it!
I think, deep down, ya'll just like funny names. ;) And where is the Pubster lately? I've seen his name on a few posts here and there, but the boy is seriously slacking off!
<<Washington and Sunderland West (and yes, the Washington part IS connected with the United States - that's the original Washington where the American connection comes from) >>
Yeah, and his original English family crest had -- guess what? -- some stars and stripes on it. Formed the loose basis of the flag (which of course has been modified further over the years).
<<There is this film (a comedy film called Privates on Parade - all about a wacky troupe of British Army personnel>>
Somehow, "Privates On Parade" didn't immediately conjure up a military image for me. Although they were standing at attention.....
Constituency:
SOUTH HOLLAND AND THE DEEPINGS
County: Lincolnshire, Eastern England
Conservative held Constituency
Total electorate of registered voters: 70,861
John Hayes ........Conservative 25,611
Graham Walker.. Labour 14,512
Grace Hill.......... Liberal Democrat 4,761
Malcolm Charlesworth...... UK Independence 1,318
Majority ................................................ 11,099 24.0%
Turnout 46,202 65.2% of the total electorate
Swing: 4.0% from Labour to Conservative
Description of the Constituency:
The Holland part of this seat's name comes from a large rural district in this constituency in South Lincolnshire, so-named because of its striking likeness to that dead flat, low-land country across the North Sea, and it's preponderance of windmills.
Deepings is derived from not only the town of Market Deeping but also the collection of little villages in the area - West Deeping, Deeping Gate, Deeping St Nicholas and Deeping St James, which are all situated within the constituency.
The local council described this area as "once a vast tract of swamps and waterlogged marshes", but extensive land reclamation from the sixteenth century onwards has led to the region, with its hugely fertile alluvial soil, becoming one of the prime areas of crop production in the UK. The sea and hence water has always been the area's inveterate enemy (as in the other Holland just across the North Sea) and of necessity dykes and sea walls offer protection from rising tides and sea surges which occur from time to time. Hence the Deeping in all those village names.
Dutch engineers and scientists had their part to play in the reclamation schemes, and the result of their work has been to make the seat truly reminiscent of its namesake in the Low Countries. Another similarity with the Netherlands is the cultivation of tulips, particularly around Spalding, as well as many other types of bulb and root vegetables. The soil of the area is black in colour but immensely fertile.
Most of the residents of this constituency are white middle class owner occupiers.
SOUTH HOLLAND AND THE DEEPINGS
County: Lincolnshire, Eastern England
Conservative held Constituency
Total electorate of registered voters: 70,861
John Hayes ........Conservative 25,611
Graham Walker.. Labour 14,512
Grace Hill.......... Liberal Democrat 4,761
Malcolm Charlesworth...... UK Independence 1,318
Majority ................................................ 11,099 24.0%
Turnout 46,202 65.2% of the total electorate
Swing: 4.0% from Labour to Conservative
Description of the Constituency:
The Holland part of this seat's name comes from a large rural district in this constituency in South Lincolnshire, so-named because of its striking likeness to that dead flat, low-land country across the North Sea, and it's preponderance of windmills.
Deepings is derived from not only the town of Market Deeping but also the collection of little villages in the area - West Deeping, Deeping Gate, Deeping St Nicholas and Deeping St James, which are all situated within the constituency.
The local council described this area as "once a vast tract of swamps and waterlogged marshes", but extensive land reclamation from the sixteenth century onwards has led to the region, with its hugely fertile alluvial soil, becoming one of the prime areas of crop production in the UK. The sea and hence water has always been the area's inveterate enemy (as in the other Holland just across the North Sea) and of necessity dykes and sea walls offer protection from rising tides and sea surges which occur from time to time. Hence the Deeping in all those village names.
Dutch engineers and scientists had their part to play in the reclamation schemes, and the result of their work has been to make the seat truly reminiscent of its namesake in the Low Countries. Another similarity with the Netherlands is the cultivation of tulips, particularly around Spalding, as well as many other types of bulb and root vegetables. The soil of the area is black in colour but immensely fertile.
Most of the residents of this constituency are white middle class owner occupiers.