Which Romance language sounds more Slavic?

are made of the same poor and alterated human material! And I am not talking badly about anybody. I am just speaking the truth;you like it or not. I am fed up with you whims. All of you who are complaining about gypsies in Europe, or about Romanians, Albanians or so, are exactly the first ones who should shut the mouth up!

In all you entire history you didn't know anything else than going over other people's places , rubbing, killing, raping them, putting them in chains and selling them as slaves and you suggests me to not talk bad about the English?

I wouldn't if you had been seeing a bit of regrets, and reserve in your behaviour across the other but I didn't. Now when you are showing so much disregard and down talks on the eastern Europeans, do you think that we continue to tolerate you as such? The Brits, the Spaniards, the Turks, the Germans, the Austrians, the Dutch and even the French, all of you who have colonized other nations, who pulled trough fire and sword so many men, women and children; who made so many people suffer, exactly you are complaining now about a hand of gypsies who are doing nothing but stealing from your pockets? Shame on you!

I shouldn't come to the point to be forced to speak out my thought about you. you should have shown a bit of common sense and stay calm on your feet.

You are the most primitive and rude nations on this earth and because of you we continue to have so many problems today; problems of all kind: political, military, religious, economical, and social. Show a bit of consideration and wake up, learn from your past and shut the hell up!

That's the real picture of you and keep it in mind! Only the politeness and the tolerance of the others made them not saying anything , not blaming you of anything but you cannot appreciate that. You allow yourselves all kind of isnults accross us and you want me to swollow it.

If you don,t understand what I am saying, go and see the First Nations in North America and complain in front of them about how much you suffer because of Gypsies, Romanians, Albanians, Bulgarians and whatever other East Europeans and you will get their full understanding and compassion.

<<But they're still people: they're just disadvantaged and for some reason often deal with their problems in different ways>>

Yes, gypsies often deal with their problems in different ways, usually by murder, stealing and fraud. I don't deny the fact that there are some honest gypsies, but it's an exception. Everyone in eastern Europe hates them: Russians, Ukrainians, Hungarians, even Romanians. They were hated in the Soviet Union. Why? Because as a rule they're criminals, but their peculiarity is that they think themselves honest people. In the regions where many gypsies live, parents almost always teach their children: "Never talk to a gypsy! They're dangerous." When I was a child whenever I came across Gypsies, I always crossed to the other side of the street. They accosted children and often told them: "Give me your money or a terrible unhappiness will befall you" or "Give me your money and I'll tell you your destiny". If you refused, they threatened you, shouted at you, grabbed you by your elbows, shoulders, swore at you. In the crowd they picked out small children or naive-looking people and accosted them. Gypsies also stole things, they often were pickpockets. Nowadays their number has diminished: probably, they are emigrating to western Europe or America where stupid people, infected with political correctness, pity them. I'll give you another example of what gypsies are like as people. Trying to increase birth rates the Ukrainian government in 2005 introduced relatively high payments for people who gave birth to a child, the more children you had, the more money you got. The money were paid immediately after the birth of a child. What was the result? The birth rates of Ukrainians and Russians increased only slightly, however the birth rate of gypsies increased dramatically. Gypsies tried to get pregnant asap (There appeared many pregnant gypsies who were 15-16 years old), gave birth to their babies, received money, and immediately abandoned their children, signed official refusals and left their babies in hospitals. After that they immediately got pregnant again, and did the same thing over and over many times. It was not a common incident, it was a widespread practice, which resulted in demands by people to modify the law so that to stop gypsies from giving birth to innumerable babies and leaving them. It was a sort of business for gypsies. They didn't care a damn about their children.

The only positive thing is that many gypsies are emigrating to western countries.

Most Gypsies/Romanians I have met on my travels to the wilds of continental Europe have been cool. Young or old, they seem more streetwise, vibrant, happier and way more more multilingal then their persecuters. In fact, way back in the days, I use to make a point of asking Gypsy looking natives directions due to their English skills. The only Gypo I came across who didn't speak English actually turnt out to be a lazy big nosed Frenchman on EU benefits fleeing the high unemployment rate in France. Lots of Euro Gypsies also seem to know where the best bars, clubs and after parties are. Europeans are lucky they don't have to contend with Irish Tinkers.

I don't really have a problem with any Rroma people. From my personal experiences, I've seen that Romanians really seem to dislike gypsies, even more in recent times because of the image they're giving them, and maybe because of the similarity of the names, but they do seem to have a long, not so pleasant history. If they did make them slaves and persecute them for so long, maybe they are getting what they deserve now.
And outside of that, Romania still doesn't exactly have the cleanest record ever: they sided with Hitler and Mussolini in WW2 and had a fascist dictatorship under their Marshal Antonescu and the Iron Guard or Garda de Fier before that, and atrocities were committed in regards to the Jewish community, though many were eventually saved. So enough with all this hate: it doesn't lead to good results.

I'm afraid some people can't tell Gypsies from other dark-looking people, for example Romanians. Romanians are not ideal people, but they are much more better than Gypsies. Real Gypsies sometimes have poor knowledge even of the language of the country they were born in. Steaminggeezer, believe me, if ever you had met Gypsies in their natural surrounding, you would have remembered that meeting for a long time, and those memories wouldn't have been positive. However, probably you like your money to be stolen from you or maybe you like being tricked out of money. Another thing Gypsies sometimes do is murdering for money. For example not long ago I watched a report on TV about Gypsies hacking to death with axes an elderly couple for a very small amount of money.

Beware of Gypsies! That's what every reasonable person should remember.

Lol stop being absurd. Everyone in the civilized world knows Romanians don't have any kind of money or wealth for Gypsies to steal! We have all seen the TV pics of mobs of Romanian villagers fighting over loaves of bread dropped by Royal British Air Force. The day a Romanian has anything worth getting robbed off by either Gypsies, Scousers or kids for Peckham, is the day you will see pigs fly..

<<At least British people keep their alcohol consumption confined to bars>>

Sooo false. It's frequent to find drunk women lying on the streets without underwear in Spanish touristic places, specially in summer. Some of them were thrown to the container by the garbage collectors accidentally.Also the British are famous for attending to sport events totally drunk and then they start messing and fighting with each other. Does the term "hoolligan" sound familiar to you?.

<<Give me your money or a terrible unhappiness will befall you" or "Give me your money and I'll tell you your destiny". If you refused, they threatened you, shouted at you, grabbed you by your elbows, shoulders, swore at you. In the crowd they picked out small children or naive-looking people and accosted them. >>

Interesting. In Spain they do the same but with slight different techniques. For example they "help" you to park your car. If you don't give them a pair of euros for their "services" you may find when you go back that the tires of your cars are puncture. I wonder if this is a genetic gypsy behaviour or part of their ancestral culture. In this case it is interesting that they no longer speak their old language, at least not in Spain, but on the other hand keep this antisocial behavior well alive. If the USSR with their progressive approach based on education and patience didn't make of the gypsies civilised people then nobody will and not of course the Western nations that even consider the gypsy crimminal way of life does not need to be corrected. So the only solution is gas chambers. Don't alarm, my conclusion is flawlessly logical. Either that or massive deportation to India, their homeland but the Indians are already feed up with lessen castes, so they will not tolerate it, so this option is discarded. Sterilisation may be useful too but many of the gypsy woman give birth in their houses and not in hospitals (they are already afraid of being sterilised and not being able to have 20 children each one, so they take measures).

Go for it Franco get the Gypsies you dumb Spaniard. I love a bit of black on black violence.

That's just disgusting what you people are saying about the solution for gypsies. What's wrong with ya?

Oh, and about the thing "lol" said about Romanians not having anything worth stealing and them fighting over bread; yes, especially during the communist era, things were bad, but it's not quite that way anymore and wasn't always like that. I've traveled there, and it's a bit of an exaggeration. You people make it sound like it's Afghanistan or something lol. There were better times before the Second World War. At one point in the early 1900s it was the third largest producer of oil after the U.S. and Russia, with the first extractions as far back as 1857, and second largest cereal producer after Russia. The currency, the leu, was once equivalent to the French franc (today it's much worse). Here's some pictures of it during the 1930s, the time of the Great Depression in most of the world.

http://www1.pmb.ro/pmb/bucuresti/poze_meniu/poze_vechi2.html

Doesn't exactly look like some third world shithole to me.
Eventually, the communists built a lot of their plain, ugly architecture that people tend to associate with the Eastern Bloc today, including the heaviest and largest administrative building in the world, the Parliamentary Palace of Ceausescu.

http://www.hcs.harvard.edu/~hra/files/Palace_of_Parliament_0.jpg

But it has changed a bit in the last twenty years or so. The same area in the first pictures now looks more modern, even with several skyscrapers. As a whole, the country is still poor comparatively though; obviously it's not going to compare to places like France or Spain, and lots of progress can be made.

Many people here don't have the slightest idea of what they are talking about. In Western media the only pictures of Bucharest are those of the slums, it's like they are trying to say that the true image of Paris is that of the ghettos packed full of North Africans. I am not saying that Bucharest is Paris, nevertheless Bucharest has it's own appeal (especially in the Spring), see these pictures:

http://www.skyscraperlife.com/city-versus-city/21100-bucarest-vs-lima-13.html

Romania is a third world and cheap country.

Sorry for interference...I was told by a friend to go on this site and read what some people are speaking about us, Romanians, our language, our history, our culture etc.

Let me start with my fellow Franco, who ask why Romanian are ashamed to recognize the influence of Slavic vocabulary in our language.
First of all, Franco, it is nobody ashamed of that as it is no reason to be ashamed for speaking a Slavic language. In my opinion, and to my test, Serbo-Croatian is a very beautiful language; a very melodic one. As a teenager I was amazed listening to Bijelo dugme group - see the site here. Wow, I loved this group's songs, listen this:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Ea0unsTqFMM&feature=related

and listen to this too, which is Romanian. Do you feel that they sound similar? Could you say that Romanian is nicer than the Serbo_Croatian? the other no matter which? I doubt; think that both sounds beautiful, and why should we be ashamed about the Slavic influence, because it enriched our vocabulary and made our language even more beautiful? Hm, I would be surprise to hear somebody saying that...

The fact and the matter is that Romanian, even with its Slavic influence is not a Slavic language. We don't understand a dam thing of any Slavic language without learning that specific language. That's not the same when it goes to the Romance languages. I perosnally understand "standard" Italian without to learn it. I am watching "Telegiornale" / "Telejurnal" in Romanian, and understand 80% percent of what those people are saying. Is that not telling you anything? I studied French, German, English but never Italian, Spanish or Portuguese and I can say that I understand a good part of what is spoken in all these languages, especially Italian.

Every modern language has been influenced by otehr languages, Spanish, Italian, English, French etc. But the influence goes the other way around as well. The languages influenced each other since the people have gotten out of their isolation, increased the contacts to each other etc. It is a very normal process which take place even in the moment we are talking. That's the fact. My fellow Romanian who said that with only Slavic words we cannot build sentences in Romanian is absolutely true!

Then, let's take other Slavic languages: Polish for instance. Have you ever watched any of Wajda's superb films? If not, I would recommend to do that and listen to that language. You just cannot fail in love with it. And I can continue this way with any Slavic language. So, it is not about being ashamed to speak a language, not the beautiful Slavic ones, nor the ugliest one. They are the languages of our ancestors, of our fathers and forefathers and nobody is ashamed of!

I need to add here something. Have you heard about the "inventors" of Cyrillic alphabet, the brothers Cyrill and Methodius? It is said that they are Greeks born in Thessaloniki, Greece but other sources are indicating as being ARomanians (or Macedo-Romanians). No matter what exactly their origin was because important remains what they did. Based on the Greek alphabet, the created the Slavonic alphabet with which later, they translated the Bible and used it in Orthodox churches ceremonials. By those old time, the only literate people in Romania were the priests. But they used the Cyrillic alphabet introduced in the orthodox church by the two brothers mentioned above. Being Christians form the ancient times, Romanians, illiterate in a huge majority, needed to have a Bible in their language. That was the moment when the priests translated the Bible in Romanian, by using the Cyrillic alphabet. Same happened with Bible translation in Slavic languages. Since that moment, some of the nations after the level of education increased, switched to the Latin alphabet (which is not quit Latin either, but that's another subject) and other (like Russians, Bulgarians, Ukrainians, Serbs (although they use both) kept the Slavonic alphabet. In conclusion, the actual 'so called Slavic alphabet is nothing but just an improved (modernized) Cyrillic alphabet invented by the two Greek/Aromunians brothers, inspired form the Greek alphabet and nothing else. Why would we Romanians be ashamed of using this alphabet when it is very much possible to be invented by one of us? We switched because we had to...we needed the most simple signs to represent and express our language sounds, that's the way it is. That's why even Polish and Czech switched to Latin! I was better fitting their language!

Now, I want to tell something to Mike. Before accusing Romanian for participating on the Hitler's side, you need to learn a bit about the circumstances existent in that period. Many of you (even some Romanians) are looking only at one side of the WWII, impact and implication in the world political events. Everybody speaks about the Germans as a nation totally devoted to Hitler and his plans and didn't try to dig more and learn about the life of German inside Hitler's Germany. You don't even mention about the Germans who paid the life's price for not accepting Hitler's dictatorship. You ignore the indirect help given to Hitler by Chamberlain, the British Prime Minister. You ignore the fact that GB didn't respect the Polish - Britain agreement to help each other in case of an aggression form a third part.

And now, under these circumstances, when the so called Allied power (USA, GB, France, Russia) prove to give Hitler green light to attack Poland and Czech Republic, when Russia did the same and mobilized forces against Poland, and in 1940 the Russians again did annex a part of Romania, (Bassarabia).

The Molotov-Ribbentrop Pact (see here again how allies supported the Germans) was signed on August 23, 1939. By Article 4 of the secret Annex to the Treaty, Bessarabia fell within the Soviet interest zone.

In spring of 1940, Western Europe was overrun by Nazi Germany. With world attention focused on those events, on June 26, 1940, the USSR issued an ultimatum to Romania, demanding immediate cession of Bessarabia and Northern Bukovina. Romania was given four days to evacuate its troops and officials. The two provinces had an area of 51,000 km² (20,000 square miles), and were inhabited by about 3.75 million people, 85% of them Romanians, according to official sources. Two days later, Romania yielded and began evacuation. During the evacuation, from June 28 to July 3, groups of Jews - local Communists and Soviet sympathizers attacked the retreating forces, and civilians who chose to leave. The Romanian Army was also attacked by the Soviet Army, which entered Bessarabia before the Romanian administration finished retreating. The casualties reported by the Romanian Army during those seven days consisted of 356 officers and 42,876 soldiers dead or missing.

Two years after that humiliation of Romanians, Antonescu and his regime tried to remain neutral. He entered the war only in 1942 and after the Germans promised to annulled that Ribbentrop-Molotov treat (which by the way,this is even today active) in exchange of accessing the well known oil resources of Romania for feeding the Ware machine in the east front. That made the Romanians join the German forces and the only mistake they made was to go over the limit of Bassarabia. They should have stop after the Bassarabia territory recuperation. Antonescu knew that Hitler is not going to win the war but he continued to fight alongside Hitler because he had given his word of honor on this matter.

"Garda de Fier" - the Iron Guard " certainly has left a dark spot on our history although, when originally it appeared as a reaction to the increasing danger of Bolshevism. Don't forget that the initiator and the leader of this organization was born and lived his youth in Bassarabia, neighboring the Bolsheviks. The original intend of organization was to give a signal of wake up to the Romanian governance in Bucharest. The member of Iron Guard started by providing voluntary works for the communities in need and natural catastrophes. The Romanian government didn't like this type of actions and being afraid of losing the power (because Iron Guard became very much appreciated by the general masses ), it arrested Zelea Codreanu, the organization leader and in the end they killed him. (see pictures of Codreanu) :

http://www.google.ca/images?q=Zelea+codreanu'&rls=com.microsoft:en-ca:IE-SearchBox&oe=UTF-8&rlz=1I7GGLJ_ro&redir_esc=&um=1&ie=UTF-8&ei=mdvFS_WkBJGwNozOxb4O&sa=X&oi=image_result_group&ct=title&resnum=4&ved=0CCUQsAQwAw

The assassination of Codreanu and the unanimous know fact that the main nucleus of Bolsheviks was made of Jews ( Lenin, half Jew, Stalin -has Jewish roots, Trotsky -was Jew and many other) combined with the memories still fresh remained in Romanians minds since in the 40s when the Jews civilians protected by/taking advantage of the red army humiliated a disarmed Romanian army (the Jews civilians has even trowed excrement on soldiers and officers) led to the radicalization of the Iron Guard actions. its members produced a important number of atrocities, killing not only jews as you, Mike are insinuating here, but everybody they consider against Romanians and Romania. They killed our biggest historian - Nicolae Iorga; they killed prim ministers, internal affair minister, they even thought about killing the king. It was Antonescu who stopped the Iron Guard criminal acts and its rebellion. Antonescu loved his nation deeply. We know that! He is our hero no matter what you say or what politically correctness is imposing. In every Romanian soul, this is taboo: Antonescu was, is and it will remain one of the biggest Romanian figure on the heroic list. Nobody and nothing will change that , no matter what!

As about the Jews and their persecution in Romania...this is what I want to say: they brought into the country the Bolshevism on the soviet tanks and that remained vivid in the nation's collective mind. The actions of some Jews organization (like that one led by Wiesel), by what you forced us to recognize that in Romania was Holocaust, it not just disappointed us big time, but it discredited the Jews sincerity and honesty. In our eyes (which apaprently don't count a dam for you), the Jews lost their entire credibility by accusing the Romanians (who actually saved many of them, including Antonescu) from deportation to Auschwitz) of mass murdering them. Holocaust means a "complete burn of a human being with the intend of its gene extinction". That has never happened in Romania. The only deportations which took place have been conducted in north-wetern part of Transylvania, in the period when there was a Hungarian Administration, not Romanian. What is sad, is that MR. Wiesel know that and has hidden the truth by accusing Romanians instead of Hungarians.

Anyway, that's the part of history you all should have known before accusing us of mistreating the Jews. Fortunately, many Jews are people of honor and they don't forget our common ideals, fights for surviving; our cultural exchange, reciprocal influence and especially nice relations. For the love of our nation many of the most enlightened cultural figures switched from the Mosaic cult to Christianity. I have to mention here Nicolae Steinhardt, a prominent intellectual which in his latest adult life, became a monk and retired to a monastery. He is not that known to the outside world because he joined the Romanians anticommunist movement and resisted to the communists authorities made up mostly by Jews, (Anna Pauker, Marcel Pauker, Walter Roman, Silviu Bruckner, Nicolski and many, many others) by not divulging the names of his "rebels" friends preffering to joined them in jail, as I already said. I recommend Romanians to read his "Jurnalul Fericirii" (the Diary of Happiness - which I don't think that has been ever translated in other languages).

And as ussulaly, the Gypsies are left at the end...the "for ever" left overs...
Yes, I agree that back in our history it is not much to be proud of when it gets about gypsies. I don't want to continue here because I was already too long, but if you aer interested in Gypsies history and their arrival in Europe, I indicate you the site from below:

http://books.google.ca/books?id=OZAc-Lu28jMC&pg=PA7&lpg=PA7&dq=Gypsies+arrival+in+romania&source=bl&ots=Bdxk6I38zE&sig=eEhAPU0V0lIndCXWwDOVuZL3HF4&hl=en&ei=MenFS-KiMIOqNpC3-JwO&sa=X&oi=book_result&ct=result&resnum=3&ved=0CBEQ6AEwAg#v=onepage&q=Gypsies%20arrival%20in%20romania&f=false

^ this guy speaks the truth. a pretty sensible post overall. except i don't agree necessarily that antonescu should be looked at as purely a hero. he did do what he thought was in the best interest of his country though, and i have to respect that aspect of him. then again vlad dracula the impaler is also regarded as one, and he was a sadistic mofo, but he helped keep back the turks and intimidate them. the real heroes are mircea cel batran, stefan cel mare, and mihai bravu

"Romania is a third world and cheap country."

yeah, what a creative and well thought out comment. keep it up, buddy

but seriously, bucharest was known as a little paris of the east during the interwar years. and technically, the eastern bloc in europe was categorized as "second world" during the cold war, not third.

I actually am a bit impressed... Didn't quite expect that.

But still, what have Romanians ever done for the good of mankind?? ahaha