Piffle! The English are murderous, drunken tyrants. End of story!
do all Scottish, Irish and Welsh speak English?
***The English are murderous, drunken tyrants. End of story!***
I must be missing out on that sort of "fun" then!! :-( ......I've been down here in England since mid July and I haven't encountered any murderous tyrant yet (maybe some pissed out of their skulls yes, but deffo not homicidal) even when some non-murderous, non-tyrannical, non-blootered VERY English mates took me round all sorts of places around London.....from Camden Lock and Clapham Common to Hampstead Heath and Hammersmith Broadway and everywhere in between and "rahnd the 'ahses" and I've never come across any such creatures yet...even at 2am and later. I commute every working day by tube from North London (N2) to Canary Wharf (E16) and back again in mega crush rush hours and still haven't come across any "murderous, drunken tyrants" en route. Where am I going wrong?
I'm just about to go out with some similar mates now to the Notting Hill street Carnival for some fun.....what are my chances of meeting up with these tyrants you spek of then?
Cheers
I must be missing out on that sort of "fun" then!! :-( ......I've been down here in England since mid July and I haven't encountered any murderous tyrant yet (maybe some pissed out of their skulls yes, but deffo not homicidal) even when some non-murderous, non-tyrannical, non-blootered VERY English mates took me round all sorts of places around London.....from Camden Lock and Clapham Common to Hampstead Heath and Hammersmith Broadway and everywhere in between and "rahnd the 'ahses" and I've never come across any such creatures yet...even at 2am and later. I commute every working day by tube from North London (N2) to Canary Wharf (E16) and back again in mega crush rush hours and still haven't come across any "murderous, drunken tyrants" en route. Where am I going wrong?
I'm just about to go out with some similar mates now to the Notting Hill street Carnival for some fun.....what are my chances of meeting up with these tyrants you spek of then?
Cheers
Give it time, scot. Give it time. Their true colours will be flying high upon their masts. They are empire obsessive tyrants. Ask these people what they think of their empire. I suppose they'll think it was civilised and was great. You may think the same if you are a lowland scot.
Just because our empire was bigger than yours, Guest. Ours may have led to a few atrocities, but it did great things for the world
I hate all empires. They are condescending in every way. Natives die through famine, disease and from being slaughtered; just so a few fat cats can get richer. The ordinary people never really benefit; they receive the scraps from the table and that is all. The British Empire, like all empires, exploit foreign lands, and kill the uncivilised hoards, force religion and new customs on those who wish to live the life their ancestors lived. Empire is about power, wealth and a superiority complex and nothing more.
Giving a railway line and new farming methods doesn't make up for the millions of dead people. RE: famines in India and Ireland.
Giving a railway line and new farming methods doesn't make up for the millions of dead people. RE: famines in India and Ireland.
i have realy enjoyed reading thease comments, i'm cymro cymraeg (welsh speaking welshman)living in idustrial south wales and must agree the future for the language looks good! i would love to hear irish,scots and breton spoken there is nothing wrong with identity even english but i find anti welsh/celt comments by english people ignornant and baseless and think it stems from an inferiority complex that after all this time inspite of years of tyrany and colonial rule the celtic nations are still here with they're language and culture and that must be gauling to our rich neighbour i myself would like to see wales as a republic perhaps unioned with scotland/ireland (cymru not represnted on british union flag) felly daw ein dydd!
nos da
nos da
go dtí an duine as na stáiteanna Aonaithe:
Richard:
if you like Irish so much and claim to be Irish,
Why dont you just go learn it?
Richard:
if you like Irish so much and claim to be Irish,
Why dont you just go learn it?
meic, Wales is represented on the Union Flag, since the Cross of St George represents England and Wales. The only nation which really does lack any representation of that flag is Cornwall. But then it's not a proper one and doesn't really count too much.
Statistics on a flourishing 21st Century WELSH LANGUAGE in Wales
The initial 2001 Census figures released back in February 2003 showed an increase of around 80,000 in the number of those who can speak Welsh fluently. The figures released in May showed that 37.7% of children between 3 and 15 years old in Wales can speak the language fluently – which is an INCREASE of 13.4 percentage points since the last Census in 1991. These statistics make interesting reading but how much use are they as we try and assess how many people actually use the Welsh language in their everyday lives across the WHOLE of Wales? Does the fact that the 742 (68%) of those living in CWMLLYNFELL, Neath Port Talbot, who state that they can speak Welsh, mean that 742 people actually use the language everyday?
The Census remains the most comprehensive source of information available to us. This said, it’s very difficult to compare the 1991 and 2001 figures correctly, especially as the boundaries of very many electoral divisions have changed over the past decade. But, we can use the information we have to take us on a virtual journey around Wales on the Traws Cambria.....the Welsh National Express Bus Service.
The National Bus Service takes us through communities where Welsh is the predominant daily language of the community, and also takes us to the industrial areas of the south, where large numbers of people speak Welsh with increasing fluency.
Our journey starts on ANGLESEY and we’re soon in the village of Bryngwran – through which the relentless streams of traffic on the A5 road roars as it approaches its destination in Holyhead. According to the 2001 Census, 76% (1233 people) can speak Welsh here in the small village. Back in 1991, this figure was 79% (1405 of the village’s inhabitants). The small decline in 2001 is due to the considerable influx of new residents from outside of Wales who are yet to learn some Welsh.
Over the Menai Straits and we’re soon in CAERNARFON, with its huge and awe inspiring 13th century castle, in the Peblig electoral division, which remains the area with the highest percentage of Welsh speakers in the whole of Wales – 88% (1942 people) in 2001, as opposed to 91% (2108 people) ten years ago. Again, the area has seen immigration from outside of Wales. A few miles down the road, and we arrive at PORTHMADOG – a town which has seen a major change in relation to the Welsh language since 1991. Back then, 85% (1378 people) spoke Welsh, now, the figure stands at 74% (2534 people) claim to understand Welsh. Porthmadog is one town which has seen its electoral divisions changed since 1991, and therefore it is impossible to ascertain a true comparison between 1991 and 2001, but yet again immigration from England, mainly, is also a factor in the changed percentage.
Our next stop is the home of over 9350 full-time University students at the time of the 2001 Census – ABERYSTWYTH, on the coast of Cardigan Bay. For the first time, students from all over the UK were counted at their term-time address, and this undoubtedly affected the results for Aberystwyth. Combining the different wards in the town in 1991 gives us a total of 6160 (or 44.5%) Welsh speakers, the most recent Census gives us a total of 43.4% (or 6555 speakers) – an increase in the number of speakers, but a decline in the percentage – something that is seen right across the County of Ceredigion as a whole. This percentage would probably have been higher had the Census taken place during the university vacation. The same will be true for Lampeter, another Ceredigion town with a University college, theological in this case.
The Traws Cambria bus then moves on to CARMARTHEN – another college town – where we see a slight drop in the percentage of Welsh speakers – from 47% in 1991 (5607 speakers) to 43% (5431 speakers) in 2001. Down the busy motorway and we’re soon in SWANSEA –a city which has seen the Welsh language speakers stabilised at just 13% of the city's total population since 1991.
A short journey down the M4 motorway, and we arrive in CARDIFF – capital city of Wales and the home of the National Assembly for Wales. Once inside the boundaries of the City of Cardiff we head for the Butetown area - most surprisingly considering its very cosmopolitan nature - one of the areas of Wales which has seen a huge upturn in fortune for the Welsh Language since the 1991 census. Back then, 3.2% of the population of this small and compact inner city community in Central Cardiff (or 111 of the population) could speak Welsh. Now, the figure has risen to 8%, with 328 people identifying themselves as fluent Welsh speakers. The percentage of Welsh speakers in the outer suburbs of Cardiff is, as expected, considerably higher, in spite of the fact that the city is home to thousands of students from all over the UK and elsewhere.
This may be the end of the journey for the Traws Cambria, but our virtual bus still has one or two stops to go – the first is TORFAEN – an area which has seen an increase of 8 percentage points of Welsh speakers over the past decade. Around 12% of those living in Abersychan identify themselves as fluent Welsh speakers. RHONDDA CYNON TAF is another area which has seen a healthy increase in the percentage of Welsh speakers, with 19% of the inhabitants of the Pontypridd Town electoral division can speak fluent Welsh.
Why is there such an increase in these areas? It’s mostly down to the success of Welsh medium and bilingual education over the past decades. Years of commitment from teachers and parents alike have enabled the language to thrive – a trend which appears to be increasing at a steady pace. The most interesting factor is that the increase in the use of Welsh is most marked in the younger age groups, with the 8 to 15 age group showing the steepest rise, especially in the industrial areas of South Wales where Welsh speaking has traditionally been far less evident than the rest of Wales, especially the North and West.
Our 2001 journey through Wales was very different to the same journey undertaken in 1991. Although the percentage of Welsh speakers may have fallen in some areas affected by English immigration, the numbers are on the increase throughout Wales. What does this tell us? That we can’t look at one set of figures and assess the state of the language through percentages or numbers alone. Even stark figures like these will affect our judgement.
It’s still far too soon to be able to provide a detailed analysis of the 2001 Census, and the work will take many months to complete. However, one thing is clear – the need for all types of research – statistical, qualitative, research on the use of Welsh, among many other topics. The fact remains that the Census is no more than the view of one person in every household on one day of one decade. We cannot base our work to promote the Welsh language on these results alone.
The results of the next UK census in 2011 should make for some interesting reading in Wales.
The initial 2001 Census figures released back in February 2003 showed an increase of around 80,000 in the number of those who can speak Welsh fluently. The figures released in May showed that 37.7% of children between 3 and 15 years old in Wales can speak the language fluently – which is an INCREASE of 13.4 percentage points since the last Census in 1991. These statistics make interesting reading but how much use are they as we try and assess how many people actually use the Welsh language in their everyday lives across the WHOLE of Wales? Does the fact that the 742 (68%) of those living in CWMLLYNFELL, Neath Port Talbot, who state that they can speak Welsh, mean that 742 people actually use the language everyday?
The Census remains the most comprehensive source of information available to us. This said, it’s very difficult to compare the 1991 and 2001 figures correctly, especially as the boundaries of very many electoral divisions have changed over the past decade. But, we can use the information we have to take us on a virtual journey around Wales on the Traws Cambria.....the Welsh National Express Bus Service.
The National Bus Service takes us through communities where Welsh is the predominant daily language of the community, and also takes us to the industrial areas of the south, where large numbers of people speak Welsh with increasing fluency.
Our journey starts on ANGLESEY and we’re soon in the village of Bryngwran – through which the relentless streams of traffic on the A5 road roars as it approaches its destination in Holyhead. According to the 2001 Census, 76% (1233 people) can speak Welsh here in the small village. Back in 1991, this figure was 79% (1405 of the village’s inhabitants). The small decline in 2001 is due to the considerable influx of new residents from outside of Wales who are yet to learn some Welsh.
Over the Menai Straits and we’re soon in CAERNARFON, with its huge and awe inspiring 13th century castle, in the Peblig electoral division, which remains the area with the highest percentage of Welsh speakers in the whole of Wales – 88% (1942 people) in 2001, as opposed to 91% (2108 people) ten years ago. Again, the area has seen immigration from outside of Wales. A few miles down the road, and we arrive at PORTHMADOG – a town which has seen a major change in relation to the Welsh language since 1991. Back then, 85% (1378 people) spoke Welsh, now, the figure stands at 74% (2534 people) claim to understand Welsh. Porthmadog is one town which has seen its electoral divisions changed since 1991, and therefore it is impossible to ascertain a true comparison between 1991 and 2001, but yet again immigration from England, mainly, is also a factor in the changed percentage.
Our next stop is the home of over 9350 full-time University students at the time of the 2001 Census – ABERYSTWYTH, on the coast of Cardigan Bay. For the first time, students from all over the UK were counted at their term-time address, and this undoubtedly affected the results for Aberystwyth. Combining the different wards in the town in 1991 gives us a total of 6160 (or 44.5%) Welsh speakers, the most recent Census gives us a total of 43.4% (or 6555 speakers) – an increase in the number of speakers, but a decline in the percentage – something that is seen right across the County of Ceredigion as a whole. This percentage would probably have been higher had the Census taken place during the university vacation. The same will be true for Lampeter, another Ceredigion town with a University college, theological in this case.
The Traws Cambria bus then moves on to CARMARTHEN – another college town – where we see a slight drop in the percentage of Welsh speakers – from 47% in 1991 (5607 speakers) to 43% (5431 speakers) in 2001. Down the busy motorway and we’re soon in SWANSEA –a city which has seen the Welsh language speakers stabilised at just 13% of the city's total population since 1991.
A short journey down the M4 motorway, and we arrive in CARDIFF – capital city of Wales and the home of the National Assembly for Wales. Once inside the boundaries of the City of Cardiff we head for the Butetown area - most surprisingly considering its very cosmopolitan nature - one of the areas of Wales which has seen a huge upturn in fortune for the Welsh Language since the 1991 census. Back then, 3.2% of the population of this small and compact inner city community in Central Cardiff (or 111 of the population) could speak Welsh. Now, the figure has risen to 8%, with 328 people identifying themselves as fluent Welsh speakers. The percentage of Welsh speakers in the outer suburbs of Cardiff is, as expected, considerably higher, in spite of the fact that the city is home to thousands of students from all over the UK and elsewhere.
This may be the end of the journey for the Traws Cambria, but our virtual bus still has one or two stops to go – the first is TORFAEN – an area which has seen an increase of 8 percentage points of Welsh speakers over the past decade. Around 12% of those living in Abersychan identify themselves as fluent Welsh speakers. RHONDDA CYNON TAF is another area which has seen a healthy increase in the percentage of Welsh speakers, with 19% of the inhabitants of the Pontypridd Town electoral division can speak fluent Welsh.
Why is there such an increase in these areas? It’s mostly down to the success of Welsh medium and bilingual education over the past decades. Years of commitment from teachers and parents alike have enabled the language to thrive – a trend which appears to be increasing at a steady pace. The most interesting factor is that the increase in the use of Welsh is most marked in the younger age groups, with the 8 to 15 age group showing the steepest rise, especially in the industrial areas of South Wales where Welsh speaking has traditionally been far less evident than the rest of Wales, especially the North and West.
Our 2001 journey through Wales was very different to the same journey undertaken in 1991. Although the percentage of Welsh speakers may have fallen in some areas affected by English immigration, the numbers are on the increase throughout Wales. What does this tell us? That we can’t look at one set of figures and assess the state of the language through percentages or numbers alone. Even stark figures like these will affect our judgement.
It’s still far too soon to be able to provide a detailed analysis of the 2001 Census, and the work will take many months to complete. However, one thing is clear – the need for all types of research – statistical, qualitative, research on the use of Welsh, among many other topics. The fact remains that the Census is no more than the view of one person in every household on one day of one decade. We cannot base our work to promote the Welsh language on these results alone.
The results of the next UK census in 2011 should make for some interesting reading in Wales.
I've found that self-reporting of things such as the ability to fluently speak a language is increasingly inaccurate. These days people seem to think that if they can get by in the language that they are fluent, which isn't the case. Welsh nationalism, which has certainly been on the up since the 1991 Census, will have only skewed this effect still further.
zxczxc if you are referring to wales's annexing to england as why the cross of st george represents both contries no welsh person would reconise that!nor would most english,wales like scotland is a seperate nation with its own identity and own flags which by the way is the red dragon as well as the cross of the patrait staint of wales-st david (a gold cross on a black backround) seen all over wales, there is no sign of these on the union flag, as wales is still apart of the union for now maybe its time to show it.
When I lived in Bethesda in North Wales, in the seventies, and I wanted someone to do some welding on my CZ motorbike. I was told there was a Polish guy who lived in the back streets, who only spoke Welsh, who would do the job. I got the impression that he liked to avoid the Authorities, possibly after an unfortunate war time experience.
Great Britain is like the beatles.Two creative geniuses who totally changed the world with there creativity and ingenuity,and then theres the other two.
I came across your discussion by accident, and having quickly read through the replies to the original question, I can only see one from a native Scottish Gaelic speaker, who happens to be from Canada.
I'm a native Scottish Gaelic speaker from the isle of Lewis with a wife from the isle of Skye, and I've just spent almost five years as a minister (pastor) on North Uist. I can say with pretty much absolute certainty that there are no monolingual Scots Gaelic speakers left anywhere (apart from, as was said somewhere above, the *very* rare elderly person who has had a stroke, and who has lost the ability to speak English because of that, and very young children, who will inevitably learn English in school and from their friends and TV). The last monolingual speaker probably died in the 1990s.
My wife's grandfather was someone who used English in his job all his life, and who was just as fluent in it as in Gaelic. He had a stroke a couple of months before he died and lost his English. It does happen, but it's very unusual.
As far as mutual intelligibility with other Celtic languages goes, again, as was said above, we can understand spoken Irish and Manx with some effort, especially if they're spoken slowly. Written Irish is easier (as is Manx, once you get past the very different spelling conventions). One of my native Scots Gaelic speaking journalist friends did a conversion course to allow him to broadcast on Irish radio. The course lasted two weeks, which should give you an idea of how close the languages are.
Welsh is *not* anything like as different from English as Chinese is, contrary to what was stated above. I did Celtic Studies at university, and we found Welsh pretty easy to learn. The same applies to Cornish and Breton. The grammar is very similar, and some of the vocabulary is close to that of the Gaelic languages - e.g.
Eng - ScG - Welsh
true - fìor - gwir
four - ceithir - pedwar
sea - muir - mor
big - mor - mawr
(f in Gaelic = gw in Welsh, c in Gaelic = p in Welsh)
At the same time though, a Gaelic speaker who has never studied any Welsh/ Cornish/ Breton wouldn't have a clue what people were *saying*. Once he/she saw the language written down, he/she would be able to have a stab at what some of the words meant, but that's as far as it goes.
Hope this is helpful.
Hi Jake - cò às a tha thu? Tha mise ann an Smithers, BC, an-dràsda, ach tha sinn an dòchas gum bi sinn a'tilleadh air ais a dh'Alba an ath-bhliadhn'.
I'm a native Scottish Gaelic speaker from the isle of Lewis with a wife from the isle of Skye, and I've just spent almost five years as a minister (pastor) on North Uist. I can say with pretty much absolute certainty that there are no monolingual Scots Gaelic speakers left anywhere (apart from, as was said somewhere above, the *very* rare elderly person who has had a stroke, and who has lost the ability to speak English because of that, and very young children, who will inevitably learn English in school and from their friends and TV). The last monolingual speaker probably died in the 1990s.
My wife's grandfather was someone who used English in his job all his life, and who was just as fluent in it as in Gaelic. He had a stroke a couple of months before he died and lost his English. It does happen, but it's very unusual.
As far as mutual intelligibility with other Celtic languages goes, again, as was said above, we can understand spoken Irish and Manx with some effort, especially if they're spoken slowly. Written Irish is easier (as is Manx, once you get past the very different spelling conventions). One of my native Scots Gaelic speaking journalist friends did a conversion course to allow him to broadcast on Irish radio. The course lasted two weeks, which should give you an idea of how close the languages are.
Welsh is *not* anything like as different from English as Chinese is, contrary to what was stated above. I did Celtic Studies at university, and we found Welsh pretty easy to learn. The same applies to Cornish and Breton. The grammar is very similar, and some of the vocabulary is close to that of the Gaelic languages - e.g.
Eng - ScG - Welsh
true - fìor - gwir
four - ceithir - pedwar
sea - muir - mor
big - mor - mawr
(f in Gaelic = gw in Welsh, c in Gaelic = p in Welsh)
At the same time though, a Gaelic speaker who has never studied any Welsh/ Cornish/ Breton wouldn't have a clue what people were *saying*. Once he/she saw the language written down, he/she would be able to have a stab at what some of the words meant, but that's as far as it goes.
Hope this is helpful.
Hi Jake - cò às a tha thu? Tha mise ann an Smithers, BC, an-dràsda, ach tha sinn an dòchas gum bi sinn a'tilleadh air ais a dh'Alba an ath-bhliadhn'.