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What makes French a Latin-Germanic mixed language
greg Sat May 16, 2009 9:19 am GMT
Dont il te faudra prouver l'origine germanique si tu veux être pris au sérieux. ___________________________________________ You always want proof, evidences.
Gast : « You always want proof, evidences. »
Ça te paraît bizarre ? T'es prêt à avaler nimportnawak sans sourciller ?
Lydia Sat May 16, 2009 12:38 pm GMT
Sorry, but English language is not really considered like "germanic", it's the lingua franca, the language of USA, of course it's popular!! But German, Dutch languages are considered like uglies by many french, italian or spanish teenagers. You will never hear them use german words to be cool. ______________________________ That is true and exactly the effect that made that the invading Germanic populations started to try to speak Latin during and after the migration period. Latin as a carrier of Antique Mediterranian culture of efficience, luxury, science and civilization was felt and admitted to be highly superior or at least more attractive if compared to Germanic culture consisting of agricultural hardship, industriousness, austerity and sustainability. Since they wanted to become Latin, Germanic settlers, the forefathers of great and of the most important parts of modern French, Northern Italian and Eastern Spanish peoples, tried to learn Roman Latin. Since they were too numerous to be assimilated by the fading Roman cultural system they didn´t succeed in learning Latin but stopped at an intermediate state: French and other Romance languages are the successor languages of this intermediate state - a Latino-Germanic coproduction.
To Ouest Sun May 17, 2009 5:58 am GMT
_____________________________________________________ I'm not sure but I think it's because of Germany's History, and the fact that germanic languages are not very present in these Latin countries. You don't find many dutch teacher in Spain, Italy or France for example. The same with nordic languages. It seems like they're ashamed of their languages or they don't want foreigh people learn it. But spanish, french, or italian seem prood of their languages and their cultures. Something I don't find with germans, dutch or scandinavians. I wonder why and I think it's sad because we're all europeans and our difference is our strength. sorry for my bad english.
<<Gast : « You always want proof, evidences. »
Ça te paraît bizarre ? T'es prêt à avaler nimportnawak sans sourciller ? >> The only one I need proof from going forward is greg. He doesn't seem to know what he is talking about. I'm sure he is a charming fellow but his notions are eccentric, outlandish Otherwise I have fair confidence in most other posters of this forum (Ouest, Leasnam, Parisien, Skippy, Travis and others), but greg...that is a different story :\
" Otherwise I have fair confidence in most other posters of this forum (Ouest, Leasnam, Parisien, Skippy, Travis and others), but greg...that is a different story :\ "
Greg is the only one among those posters that tries to give arguments when he claims something... It is not just "I want this to be true, so I claim for 100 pages that it is, until I'm convinced of it." without trying to compare my arguments with the reality. " Since they wanted to become Latin, Germanic settlers, the forefathers of great and of the most important parts of modern French, Northern Italian and Eastern Spanish peoples, tried to learn Roman Latin. Since they were too numerous to be assimilated by the fading Roman cultural system they didn´t succeed in learning Latin but stopped at an intermediate state: French and other Romance languages are the successor languages of this intermediate state - a Latino-Germanic coproduction. " If romance languages were made from the germanic speakers, how can you explain that : - Italy, Spain, France, Portugal all speak romance languages (different from latin), in all places, even those which were not "settled", or not much at all, by germanics? why these places did not continued to speak langages similar to classical latin? - Why romance languages did not spread in regions that were not romanized before the fall of empire: east of Rhine? Since all the frankish empire in you theory was bases on frankish peoples that speak "germano-latin languages", why did not they spread there new germano-latin language in the germanic-speaking areas of the empire (if they were supposed to have so much wish of become latin), when they spread it in far aeas such as southern Portugal... that was not even in their empire! " Sorry, but English language is not really considered like "germanic", it's the lingua franca, the language of USA, of course it's popular!! But German, Dutch languages are considered like uglies by many french, italian or spanish teenagers. You will never hear them use german words to be cool. " English is of course considered to be a germanic language. Germanic doesn't means german. English-speaking peoples often make the confusion (because of the name "Germany" for the country) and think that being germanic necesseraly makes their languages similar to German. The common area of origin of all germanic languages is southern Scandinavia, not germany. German itself is quite different from the other germanic languages. I don't think Scandinavian languages to be ugly at all. Ikea use a lot of Swedish words for their fourniture, and it is considered fashionable. That English is the "lingua franca" doesn't change the fact that it is a germanic language. If German was the "lingua franca" it would be fashionable as well as English.
<<But German, Dutch languages are considered like uglies by many french, italian or spanish teenagers. You will never hear them use german words to be cool. >>
French language (Portuguese too) sounds ugly (maybe, because of consonant "r" pronunciation in French or of pronunciation of words with endings "-ães", "-ões" in Portuguese),but Spanish ,Italian and Brazilian Portuguese sounds very nice for me. Belgian Dutch sounds nice too.
"guest guest Mon May 18, 2009 9:33 am GMT
English is of course considered to be a germanic language. Germanic doesn't means german. English-speaking peoples often make the confusion (because of the name "Germany" for the country) and think that being germanic necesseraly makes their languages similar to German. The common area of origin of all germanic languages is southern Scandinavia, not germany. German itself is quite different from the other germanic languages. I don't think Scandinavian languages to be ugly at all. Ikea use a lot of Swedish words for their fourniture, and it is considered fashionable. That English is the "lingua franca" doesn't change the fact that it is a germanic language. If German was the "lingua franca" it would be fashionable as well as English. " ______________________________________ You didn't understand, I never say that these teenagers were right, of course it's stupid to think like them, but they're teenagers. I know english is a germanic language, but for a majority of french teenagers it's not, not in their mind. For them it's the language of USA, nothing more, nothing less. And when they say germanic languages are uglies, it's generally because of History and because they don't "think" too much.
" You didn't understand, I never say that these teenagers were right, of course it's stupid to think like them, but they're teenagers.
I know english is a germanic language, but for a majority of french teenagers it's not, not in their mind. For them it's the language of USA, nothing more, nothing less. " j'ai été il n'y a pas si longtemps un adolescent Français moyen, et oui, comme tout le monde j'ai utilisé pas mal d'anglicismes... Et en ayant conscience que l'Anglais était une langue germanique. Même si l'adjectif "germanique" n'est pas forcément reconnu de tout le monde il est évident que l'on sait a priori que l'Anglais est de la même famille linguistique que le Néerlandais, l'Allemand ou les langues Scandinaves. Tous ces pays, d'un point de vue Français, c'est ce que l'on nomme courament "les pays du nord". L'Angleterre, et donc l'Anglais font bien entendu pleinement partie de cet ensemble pour le commun des mortels. Je pense que ce sont plutôt les érudis qui vont avoir tendence à pinailler (comme on le voit ici souvent), et peut-être être aménés à considérer que, du fait de l'apport latin au vocabulaire Anglais, cette langue doive être considérée sur un plan différent des autres langues germaniques. Il est assez clai que pou la majorité des gens qui ne connaissent aucune des langues gemaniques, elles se ressemblent toutes, y compris l'Anglais bien sur.
j'ai été il n'y a pas si longtemps un adolescent Français moyen, et oui, comme tout le monde j'ai utilisé pas mal d'anglicismes... Et en ayant conscience que l'Anglais était une langue germanique.
__________________________ oui toi, mais je peux t'assurer que la majorité des jeunes que je rencontre et avec qui je parle ne savent pas que l'anglais est une langue germanique, et quand je leur dis, ils me regardent avec des yeux ronds et tous surpris. Mais je pense que ça vient du fait qu'ils ne savent pas ce que le terme "germanique" veut dire, juste de l'ignorance. Néanmoins l'allemand ou le néerlandais ont peu ou pas de succès auprès des jeunes, l'espagnol ou le japonais par contre...
le japonais
Dans mon pays le japonais n'a aucun succès auprès des jeunes, seulement l'anglais, l'espagnol et de moins en moins le français. Dans le nord on aime l'allemand aussi. Quelqu'un voit le chinois comme la langue de l'avenir, meme si je la déteste....
<<mais je peux t'assurer que la majorité des jeunes que je rencontre et avec qui je parle ne savent pas que l'anglais est une langue germanique, et quand je leur dis, ils me regardent avec des yeux ronds et tous surpris. >>
Bien, je trouve cela très intéressant, et dur pour croire. L'anglais est évidemment une langue germanique, sur le pair avec hollandais et bas l'Allemand. L'anglais culturelement aussi. Que pensent-ils l'anglais est alors, une langue romane ?
<<le japonais
Dans mon pays le japonais n'a aucun succès auprès des jeunes, seulement l'anglais, l'espagnol et de moins en moins le français. Dans le nord on aime l'allemand aussi. Quelqu'un voit le chinois comme la langue de l'avenir, meme si je la déteste.... >> Êtes-vous en Italie ?
Que pensent-ils l'anglais est alors, une langue romane ?
____________________________ Que c'est la langue des américains . Oui, je sais, c'est très stupide. |