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English People...
>Mine is definitely not bone and I've had it for about six years...<
Earrings, tattoos and ponytails on blokes are certainly useful pointers in knowing when to lock up one's daughters or look for a new solicitor or even gardener, so I really hope Damian was joking
Ted:
I certainly wasn't joking...I have a teeny weeny facial adornment just below my lower lip......my ears are free of hardware and my hair is short...just a wee bit spiky sometimes.......but please note: all daughters are as safe as the Bank of England in my presence......whether they really wish it that way or not.
"but please note: all daughters are as safe as the Bank of England in my presence......whether they really wish it that way or not."
Are we hinting at something there or am I imagining it?
"****Are we hinting at something there or am I imagining it?***
Yes " Each to their own.
"Hinting"? I have never known Damian to be subtle!
Don't worry, my sometimes spiky Scot; I got all the auricular hardware you're lacking -- seven holes, left over from my little high school goth period.... and I stopped the piercings at that! Call me a wimp, but no thanks....
"Wimp"? I have never known Ex Goth Phase Uriel to be wimping!
One piercing is enough for me......just imagine if I had seven piercings! I'd be in danger of looking like the Trevi fountain down at the pub...what a waste of good Tennents. Guest: I'm making a mega belated new year resolution in Antimoon: never to respond to any Guest postings.....now that is symptomatic of genuine wimpery if you haven't the balls to put a handle (however outrageous) to your postings. What's more, I will try and resist the temptation to even read them if they have the Guest heading....won't be that easy being the sort of unsubtle bloke I am by nature. While I'm at it......this is for the benefit of any people from WALES who may be "tuning in" today, the First of March, the national day of Wales, St David's Day. Following the example of the national media here in the UK: A Happy St David's Day to you all Or as a fair number of Welsh people would prefer, and who understand their own Language: Dydd Gwyl Dewi Sant hapus iawn i chwi oll. (That includes you Andrew in Llanfairmathafarneithaf....the Welsh honorary Scotsman :-) ) Damian, the Scottish honorary Welshman
My brother has a small earring. Lots of guys wear earrings. Just look at the England football team.
"My brother has a small earring. Lots of guys wear earrings. Just look at the England football team."
Yeah look at them. A bunch of overpaid puffs. I hope your brother doesn't take after them or it will be "arses to the wall lads" all round.
"My brother has a small earring."
Sorry to hear that. "Just look at the England football team." So the intelligentsia wear them too. Must be a comfort.
Returning - if nobody minds - to the original topic of this discussion, as an English person myself I would say that a lot of the characteristics seem to depend even now in the 21st century on age and class distinctions.
Yes there was in fact a time in the past when no person of the higher classes would deign to speak to anyone unless they had been formally introduced. (except perhaps menial household staff) It was viewed as vulgar to do otherwise and a sign of a lack of breeding - ie of being of a lower class! Nowadays I'd say that it's hard to see much reserve in the younger generations of Brits, they are loud and spontaneous, in general (I would say friendly but when in groups they're just as likely to be rude and insulting to strangers as friendly, depends on the group, or the mood they are in), but more inclined to be shy or silent as individuals, especially in new situations or with strangers. And I wouldn't say that many of them desire to be intelligent either. Most young people seem to consider education as an anathema, especially when you compare it to Americans who are articulate and convey an impression of being much more mature then their British counterparts of the same age - as a recent Channel 5 progamme on the way different young people round the world respond to different topics showed very clearly. Now the older generations - 30s upward I'd guess, though not exclusively - are more inclined to be polite and hungry to expand and share their knowledge. This is also a class thing, with middle class people considering intellect to be desireable and working class seeing little advantage in it. All these are generalisations of course. Apart from the working class people that I know - who often seem to harbour a hostility to other races and cultures - it seems to be an almost universal British trait to be fascinated by other cultures and desire to assimilate all that they can from what they find beyond our borders. This sets us aside from the French for example who are still fighting against the influx of foreign words and culture they are facing - but perhaps that is a purely anti-british trait, as we have been bickering for centuries and they don't seem at all hostile to cultures belonging to ex-French Empire states. I've often wondered if the hostility towards English words in French is based on their feeling piqued that theirs is no longer the Lingua Franca of the world and ours is.. hmm... Both young and old are private, though what you are private about and what you are willing to be open about varies with class. As a middle class person it is considered polite to greet and even have a conversation with a person behind a shop counter, so long as it isn't too busy - politeness can involve saying as little as possible on some occasions but it is the salesmen's desires about his/her privacy that are considered rather than your own. But today my friend, who calls herself Working Class And Proud Of It, told me that she would find it very rude for a shopkeeper to make any kind of small-talk or personal comment as it is not respecting HER privacy. There is also a North/South divide. My mother and father- both hailing from the north - always say what they think even if it's negative, wheras our Vicar for example and other elders in our church who come from the south coast are extremely nice in what they say to you or about you (to your face at least) and keep their opinions to themselves, which gives you a creepy feeling sometimes as you never know what they're really thinking about you, as they wouldn't dream of saying while the information could get back to you in any way. Northerners in my experience at least find such behaviour false and therefore impolite! It's hard to work out what is considered polite and what isn't as every sub group seems to have its own ideas! I wouldn't know about how shy/cold the British are in comparison with other cultures as I have only really experience of Americans, I do know that we have an inclination to find their initial friendliness a little offputting - rude even in some ways, I guess that comes back to the Brits high appreciation of privacy - and possibly superficial. Brits are perhaps more reticent to begin with but open up very quickly, they are simply more afraid of what response they will get so they might appear a bit guarded until they've got a measure of what kind of person the one they are talking to is, but this can take a matter of sentances as much as it could take a few weeks or months. On the drinking culture, a recent discussion on the subject on the BBC mentioned that it is a 'Germanic' trait to seldom drink at all except perhaps with a special meal (rather than with most meals like southern Europe) and then drink to excess as a social exercise. The trait was linked to our reticence/reserve, as apparently those in France say are more likely to complain or express their emotions freely or air their views with less censure, and as a result don't have the same need to blow off steam on another occasion, wheras northern Europeans in particular the British are more 'polite' and by that I mean closed, so that there has to be some other way for them to let out what they have supressed, which is why it is hard to get a Brit angry, but when he IS angry, he is very angry indeed! I wonder if the prevelence of such stress-related illnesses as Irritable Bowel etc are connected to the amount that people keep their true feelings hidden and therefore boiling under the surface?! It takes its toll on the digestive system! ;-) The only universal British trait I can think of is cynicism..! Although humour comes a close second as it merges very well... irony.. sarcasm.. self-depreciation!
Personally I'm incredibly proud of our Royal Family dispite their faults, but perhaps that's because I was taught about what they were actually useful for, which is not in the UK National Curriculum. Actually we'd be in a great deal of danger without them! And although I'm all for Democracy, with people like Blair at the helm I'd rather give them the longevity of a monarch to keep them in check than a President who changes identity every 8 years.
And I'd be very miffed if the Americans stopped calling the language they speak English. Perhaps I'm the only one this side of the Atlantic who would be... Speaking of which, my Dutch friend who is studying English at University in Holland says that there are two seperate English courses on offer there, American English and British English. I wonder if that's true anywhere else? She told me a story about her lecturer using an extract from a newspaper column to help teach them about English-speaking culture, and he was continuously appologising for the grammer and saying that it was full of mistakes. A way into the lecture he paused and said "actually, it's written by an American" and everybody laughed as if that explained everything..! I do find it annoying when Americans make fun of Brits for pronouncing things wrong - like the fact that we sometimes put emphases on different syllables to Americans - and make a concerted (or should that be condescending) effort to correct us; "actually it's pronounced..." like it was their language originally! But then I wouldn't have a problem with correcting an American's pronunciation, because we naturally are superior! ;-) I wonder if the relationship between America and Britain is a lot like that of Rome and Greece respectively during the time of the Roman Empire - not just in terms of language. Greek rather than Latin was the universal language and the Greeks looked down on the Romans in many ways for what they viewed as a bastardization of their culture. But I imagine there was a lot of jealousy in there too, as the ex-rulers of the known world being pipped at the post by the Barbarian upstarts! hehe.
I should point out that I have a lot of American friends and they are all lovely people. It occured to me that making a lot of tongue in cheek comments to a bunch of posters you've never met before might be a little stupid, as my sense of humour in unfamiliar to you all. No offence meant in any of the above!
I hate to be the bearer of the hard truth but English people and/or English speakers are no different from any other peoples and or culturistic peoples. Just as some Americans are kind, some are "hard boiled". I am surrounded by Mexican Americans and I could easily say that they are friendly but-- "out there somewhere" there are some "not nice" MExicans. Niceness doesn't pertain particularly to any language group.
***But then I wouldn't have a problem with correcting an American's pronunciation, because we naturally are superior! ;-)***
Very interesting posts all the way through, Amatire....spot on. I've never had the experience of being corrected by an American on Brit style word pronunciations.......if I ever did I would merely smile a smile that neither conveys superiority or stupidity....just valid difference. I've accepted their pronunciations without any comment...it is, after all their brand of the English Language they're speaking, which we seem to have agreed should not be called American! Being a Brit here now, Amatire, I don't have a problem suggesting that you most probably mean that we revel in irony, sarcasm and self-deprecation? I don't think we're quite ready for depreciation just yet. Sorry...just being nationalistically sarcastic...... :-) |