forum franco-hispanique / foro hispano-frances

Guest, just a few comments this time.

I agree that addressing people in English in a non-English-speaking country is sometimes impolite. People should at least learn enough of the language to ask if the other person speaks English. I wouldn't say that this rudeness has to do with colonialism, though, just the desire to be understood quickly. Also in some expensive tourist hotels and stores that sell to tourists, the English-speaking tourists may believe that it's the responsibility of the businesses to provide persons who can speak their language.

I haven't been outside the country lately, but when I used to travel, I nearly always avoided the tourist places and mingled with the people, many of whom didn't speak English. Usually I went to Spanish-speaking countries (at the time I spoke Spanish well), or to countries where I knew the languages at least a little, and I could look up what I wanted to ask ahead of time and understand the most likely answers (if spoken simply and clearly).

>You do the same thing [by killing murderers]. Guest

People aren't executed just for killing. They're executed for killing other human beings unjustly, and there's a big difference between killing someone in self-defense (who's trying to kill you), or even in executing a murderer, and killing an innocent person. (The biggest problem I have with the death penalty is that juries are not infallible, and we can’t always be sure that the convicted person is really guilty.) Who or what is being killed matters. Every time you walk across the lawn or even across a rug, you crush to death many thousands of tiny organisms. These are innocent creatures, but people kill them anyway. Perfect moral purity is impossible to attain.

Swearing on the Bible: It's not true that in the United States people must swear on the Bible (in trials, for instance). They can swear without it, or just affirm without even using the name of God.

Patriotism: People are not required to be patriotic and to wave flags. The courts have said that people even have a constitutional right to burn the American flag as a form of protest. Also students cannot be required to say the pledge of allegiance. Some Americans are patriotic, but in my opinion far too many are not.

The Death penalty is just inhumane to me.Barbaric even.

I agree, Sander. To me it's a barbaric relic which has no place in the modern world. (And to all the people reading this who are in favour of the death penalty, don't bother posting a message trying to convince me - you never will)

"constitutional right to burn the American flag as a form of protest."

Really? It is rulled by the constitution, even a form of rebellion is ruled by the justice. What a big democracy, every feeling of rebellion is destroyed. Be proud to be Etat Unien!!!!

According to Gjone, it is not inhuman. This is the way he is thinking and we wants us to believe they are a democracy, when they KILL PEOPLE!!!!

Murderers!!! Murderers!!! Murderers!!! Murderers!!! Murderers!!!

There is not any european country which uses the death penalty!!!

=>There is not any european country which uses the death penalty!!!<=

Yes there are.

Sorry, i was thinking about the european community.

Which countries are you talking about?

European countries.You might want to forget it but Europe doesn't stop at the EU border.

I can't speak with enthusiasm for the death penalty, but I shed no tears for some murderers, especially for serial killers. One was just caught in Kansas, and he will not be executed because there was no death penalty when he committed his crimes. This hypocrite pretended to be a religious person and a law-abiding member of the community, and all the time he was secretly going out and torturing and killing innocent victims, 10 persons, -- 7 women, two children, and one man. There's no doubt at all that he's guilty.

http://tinyurl.com/arm3s

No, i was only thinking about the Europe Community, that's all. Ooooops sorry i forgot you were not one of them, the Dutch voted no. So yes you are European but not from the European community.

I apologize.

What the hell are you talking about?!

Gjones,

Of course this is horrible, but i think the guy needs a treatment (psychiatric) and cannot be free but in jail. Not to be punished but because he is dangerous.

That serial killer has killed people for sure, but how many people Bush has killed, T Blair, Miterrand (french). I wrote french for Miterrand just to show you i am honnest and admit my country has killed some people.

How many weapons do they sell in the world (France, USA, Germany, Italy...). And these people are free, rich and REALLY DANGEROUS for the all world.

Bush and Blair are doing good for the world. How many people did Saddam Hussein kill? He and the terrorists (and those who encourage them from abroad) are responsible not only for the people that they kill, but for the people killed by the allied troops who are trying to bring freedom to the Middle East.

Ultimately I don't believe that values can be argued. It's a matter of empathy. Most persons will feel some empathy for the murderer in the story I linked to, no matter how much they despise him for his crimes. I do too to some degree. Unlike the victims he's someone that we can still see and hear, and recognize as a fellow human being. I make an effort, though, to keep in mind the people that he tortured to death, and to empathize with them (as much as I can without damaging my own psychological health -- I don't dwell on the images of their deaths because that would cause me unnecessary suffering).

It's possible that this very evil man will suffer more in prison than he would if he were executed. That's not necessarily so, though. Some prisoners adapt well to prison life. He'll probably be able to watch TV, read books, have at least some friends in prison, and if he marries (and there are sick people who will marry almost any murderer), he'll have conjugal visits. In the meantime his victims will be long dead. The adults had their lives cut short, and the children had their opportunity to live taken away from them.

I can't help thinking of the people that he tortured and murdered. I believe that some of them would have demanded nothing less than his death.