Addendum.....
Portuguese:
http://static.unilang.org/resources/pronscript/sonidos/soundfiles/sonido_pt.mp3
Portuguese:
http://static.unilang.org/resources/pronscript/sonidos/soundfiles/sonido_pt.mp3
Portuguese, the most successfull language in the world!
Ok... In reply to Im from brazil... (Or from wherever intelligence seems to be over rated...)
"Hey Viriatum, about "Spanish is Not a language..." sorry for that, we say spanish cuz in portuguese we can use two words for that, "castelhano/ castilian" or "espanhol"(this one is generally common spoken) so (...)"
Again this issue, after having been more than clearly demonstrated that Spanish is NOT a language but only a Nationality? Go back a couple of pages, please!!!
"(...)Viriatum, how much languages u speak? (...)"
Maybe you wanted to ask me how MANY languages I speak?
I speak only 7 languages... Want the full list?
Portuguese (native), English, German, Castillian, Italian, french and Mirandese (Portugal's 2nd Official Language, as aproved by the Portuguese Parliament in Sep 17 1998 and fully implemented in Jan 29 1999, by force of Law 7/99).
"(...) Do u know languages or just know its history?" >>> No, I don't know languages, that person has never been introduced to me and I'd certainly not know that person's history, if I never met them...
Oh... Were you asking if I speak other languages or just know THEIR History? I couldn't quite understand... Sorry for that...
"Hey Viriatum, about "Spanish is Not a language..." sorry for that, we say spanish cuz in portuguese we can use two words for that, "castelhano/ castilian" or "espanhol"(this one is generally common spoken) so (...)"
Again this issue, after having been more than clearly demonstrated that Spanish is NOT a language but only a Nationality? Go back a couple of pages, please!!!
"(...)Viriatum, how much languages u speak? (...)"
Maybe you wanted to ask me how MANY languages I speak?
I speak only 7 languages... Want the full list?
Portuguese (native), English, German, Castillian, Italian, french and Mirandese (Portugal's 2nd Official Language, as aproved by the Portuguese Parliament in Sep 17 1998 and fully implemented in Jan 29 1999, by force of Law 7/99).
"(...) Do u know languages or just know its history?" >>> No, I don't know languages, that person has never been introduced to me and I'd certainly not know that person's history, if I never met them...
Oh... Were you asking if I speak other languages or just know THEIR History? I couldn't quite understand... Sorry for that...
In case you (Im from brazil) are trying to understand the last 2 sentences on the above post (as I have reasons to believe you hardly could)... It was pure SARCASM!
<<<Romanian is grotesque looking when 'written' and 'sounds' like half russian with an latin twist when spoken. Moreover, It borrowed extensively from French and Italian. So what am I to say?? Romanian is pretty much an artificial language and in the next 50 years or so it'll be no more then a clergy language of Romania. They'll probably speak
"russian or german" again; that's my take. Good-day
Listen to this romanian clip....(which suprisingly sounds similar to Portugues)>>
To me that sound clip sounded very much like a language of Latin origin. If you actually learned anything about Romania you would realize the language is not dying out because of the influence of media from all over the latin world. If you look at their music charts you would realize singers from latin countries are very popular.
"russian or german" again; that's my take. Good-day
Listen to this romanian clip....(which suprisingly sounds similar to Portugues)>>
To me that sound clip sounded very much like a language of Latin origin. If you actually learned anything about Romania you would realize the language is not dying out because of the influence of media from all over the latin world. If you look at their music charts you would realize singers from latin countries are very popular.
WOW! Andalucian Spanish sounded like she didn't even pronounce her words fully! It sounded incredibly different from the Spanish I'm used to. I can see now why some Europeans hold the view they do with regard to Spanish from Spain. Latin American Spanish is much prettier.
Spoken Portuguese sounds nothing like Spanish.
Spoken Portuguese sounds nothing like Spanish.
"To me that sound clip sounded very much like a language of Latin origin. If you actually learned anything about Romania you would realize the language is not dying out because of the influence of media from all over the latin world. If you look at their music charts you would realize singers from latin countries are very popular." <<<< Doesn't make any sense!
The Romanian Language is not dieing, not because of the influence of any media, pop charts, music or because their singers are popular.
The Romanian Language is not dieing out, BECAUSE, till this day it still HAS NOT!
Romania is the only "Latin" country in that region, surrounded by slavic countries (currently Serbia, Hungary, Bulgaria, Ukraine, Moldova) for centuries!
If a language survives for such a long time with such linguistic pressure, it's highly unlikely it will "perish" any time soon.
Romania is a big country (about the same size as Poland), inhabitted by over 22,5 million Romanians, from which 7% are Hungarian descent.
I cannot imagine all of them stop speaking Romanian because their singers weren't popular anymore...
It's also highly improbable that the Romanians would adopt any other language, being (like the Portuguese) so proud of their past, their History, their success in fighting back external influences (Turks, Russians, Germans, Greeks and Hungarians) and foreign occupations (basicaly the same Turks, Russians, Germans, Greeks and Hungarians).
Concerning the Romanian Language sounding like Portuguese, it's highly unlikely for a language that originates from a mix of native Dacian and Latin would sound like Portuguese.
The words that do, it's simple because they have in common the same phonetics, when spoken, nothing else.
"Romanian is pretty much an artificial language and in the next 50 years or so it'll be no more then a clergy language of Romania" <<<<< This doesn't make any sense!
"Romanian is grotesque looking when 'written' and 'sounds' like half russian with an latin twist when spoken. Moreover, It borrowed extensively from French and Italian" >>> Doesn't make any sense either!
The french never were in Romania, nor did the Italians! Romans did, Italians never did! If the Romanian Language has words that look/sound like french, Italian, Portuguese, Catalán, Castillian, Galician, Aragonés, Lianese, is only because... Guess what... They're ALL LATIN LANGUAGES!!!
Romanian comes from Latin and also Dacian, but is essencially a Latin Language!
The Romanian Language is not dieing, not because of the influence of any media, pop charts, music or because their singers are popular.
The Romanian Language is not dieing out, BECAUSE, till this day it still HAS NOT!
Romania is the only "Latin" country in that region, surrounded by slavic countries (currently Serbia, Hungary, Bulgaria, Ukraine, Moldova) for centuries!
If a language survives for such a long time with such linguistic pressure, it's highly unlikely it will "perish" any time soon.
Romania is a big country (about the same size as Poland), inhabitted by over 22,5 million Romanians, from which 7% are Hungarian descent.
I cannot imagine all of them stop speaking Romanian because their singers weren't popular anymore...
It's also highly improbable that the Romanians would adopt any other language, being (like the Portuguese) so proud of their past, their History, their success in fighting back external influences (Turks, Russians, Germans, Greeks and Hungarians) and foreign occupations (basicaly the same Turks, Russians, Germans, Greeks and Hungarians).
Concerning the Romanian Language sounding like Portuguese, it's highly unlikely for a language that originates from a mix of native Dacian and Latin would sound like Portuguese.
The words that do, it's simple because they have in common the same phonetics, when spoken, nothing else.
"Romanian is pretty much an artificial language and in the next 50 years or so it'll be no more then a clergy language of Romania" <<<<< This doesn't make any sense!
"Romanian is grotesque looking when 'written' and 'sounds' like half russian with an latin twist when spoken. Moreover, It borrowed extensively from French and Italian" >>> Doesn't make any sense either!
The french never were in Romania, nor did the Italians! Romans did, Italians never did! If the Romanian Language has words that look/sound like french, Italian, Portuguese, Catalán, Castillian, Galician, Aragonés, Lianese, is only because... Guess what... They're ALL LATIN LANGUAGES!!!
Romanian comes from Latin and also Dacian, but is essencially a Latin Language!
"WOW! Andalucian Spanish sounded like she didn't even pronounce her words fully! It sounded incredibly different from the Spanish I'm used to. I can see now why some Europeans hold the view they do with regard to Spanish from Spain. Latin American Spanish is much prettier."
Oh boy... How many times do I have to say this... Spanish is a Nationality, not a Language! Do you have anmy idea how many languages are spoken in Spain? Go back a few pages, please!
"Spoken Portuguese sounds nothing like Spanish." <<<First off, a spoken Language cannot ever sound like a Nationality! It's a scientific impossibility! Same as a dog not ever being able to sound like a planet!
2nd... Of course Portuguese sounds nothing like CASTILLIAN... Like it doesn't sound like French, Italian, Lianese, Aragonés, Romanian or Catalán! It could sound like Galician, in Northern Portugal, but that is basicly because not 800 years ago, it was the same language... Galaico-Portuguese!!!
Oh boy... How many times do I have to say this... Spanish is a Nationality, not a Language! Do you have anmy idea how many languages are spoken in Spain? Go back a few pages, please!
"Spoken Portuguese sounds nothing like Spanish." <<<First off, a spoken Language cannot ever sound like a Nationality! It's a scientific impossibility! Same as a dog not ever being able to sound like a planet!
2nd... Of course Portuguese sounds nothing like CASTILLIAN... Like it doesn't sound like French, Italian, Lianese, Aragonés, Romanian or Catalán! It could sound like Galician, in Northern Portugal, but that is basicly because not 800 years ago, it was the same language... Galaico-Portuguese!!!
To me the clearest out of all the spanish recordings was the argentinian pronunciation (I'm used to hearing Panamanians, Colombians, and Venezuelan speak). So for me with some of my family being from Panama the Mexican speak was the most alien (Panama is a Caribbean spanish speaking country). The Brazilian recording was very clear and understandable to me but surprisingly, the portuguese recording was hard for me to understand. What part of Portugal was that recording taken from because it was a weird accent and not want i'm used to hearing in terms of Eu.Portuguese. By the way Catala may sound somewhat like portuguese, but as for intelligability Catala was hard to understand.
Ricardo Sat Sep 09, 2006 3:54 am GMT
««Portugal was the southern region of Galicia, so therefore it was part of Galicia. It split and it becameknow as portugal. »»
Ricardo, Galicia and Portugal share a lot. But if you want to talk about Portugal before the independence you have to talk about the beginning of Portugal and I am assuming the region that was called Portugal and the archaic forms of the name after the Roman Empire:
1- The Kingdom of Portu-Cale – the Suevi kingdom from 410 to 586 a.d.
Kings:
Hermeric (409-438)
Rechila (438-448)
Rechiar (448-456)
Aioulf (456-457), in the south alone
Framta (456-457), in the north alone
Maldras (457-459), in the south alone
Richimund (459-463), in the north alone
Frumar (459-463), in the south alone
Remismund (459-469), whole realm from 463
Obscurity (469-550), during this time one name alone is known: Theodemund, but perhaps also a Vermund, Rechila II, and Rechiar II
Carriaric (550-559)
Theodemar (559-570)
Miro (570-583)
Eboric (also called Euric) (583-584)
Andeca (584-585),
Malaric (585-586),
[wikipedia]
2-County of Portucale 868 (not a kingdom)
3-The Kingdom of Galicia and Portucale – in 1065
King García II
4-County of Portucale 1095(not a kingdom)
5- Kingdom of Portugal- In 1143,
King Afonso Henriques I
Etc etc until today.
If we are going to follow your views Portugal exists since 410 a.d. and is a Suevi country.
What I am saying is that Portugal since its independence in 1143 was never part of Galicia or Galicia part of Portugal.
http://darkwing.uoregon.edu/~klio/maps/re/A451EU.gif
http://www.portuguesefoundation.org/historia1.htm
««Portugal was the southern region of Galicia, so therefore it was part of Galicia. It split and it becameknow as portugal. »»
Ricardo, Galicia and Portugal share a lot. But if you want to talk about Portugal before the independence you have to talk about the beginning of Portugal and I am assuming the region that was called Portugal and the archaic forms of the name after the Roman Empire:
1- The Kingdom of Portu-Cale – the Suevi kingdom from 410 to 586 a.d.
Kings:
Hermeric (409-438)
Rechila (438-448)
Rechiar (448-456)
Aioulf (456-457), in the south alone
Framta (456-457), in the north alone
Maldras (457-459), in the south alone
Richimund (459-463), in the north alone
Frumar (459-463), in the south alone
Remismund (459-469), whole realm from 463
Obscurity (469-550), during this time one name alone is known: Theodemund, but perhaps also a Vermund, Rechila II, and Rechiar II
Carriaric (550-559)
Theodemar (559-570)
Miro (570-583)
Eboric (also called Euric) (583-584)
Andeca (584-585),
Malaric (585-586),
[wikipedia]
2-County of Portucale 868 (not a kingdom)
3-The Kingdom of Galicia and Portucale – in 1065
King García II
4-County of Portucale 1095(not a kingdom)
5- Kingdom of Portugal- In 1143,
King Afonso Henriques I
Etc etc until today.
If we are going to follow your views Portugal exists since 410 a.d. and is a Suevi country.
What I am saying is that Portugal since its independence in 1143 was never part of Galicia or Galicia part of Portugal.
http://darkwing.uoregon.edu/~klio/maps/re/A451EU.gif
http://www.portuguesefoundation.org/historia1.htm
LAA
««Spoken Portuguese sounds nothing like Spanish.»»
Yes, it also sounds nothing like French, Italian, Russian or German.
I just wonder how you can learn to speak Portuguese in a month. And I mean Portuguese not Portunhol.
««Spoken Portuguese sounds nothing like Spanish.»»
Yes, it also sounds nothing like French, Italian, Russian or German.
I just wonder how you can learn to speak Portuguese in a month. And I mean Portuguese not Portunhol.
Romania is a big country (about the same size as Poland),
--------------------------------------------
No. It's about the same size as Great Britain, just slightly smaller.
Britain - 244,820 sq km
Romania - 237,500 sq km
Poland - 312,685 sq km
--------------------------------------------
No. It's about the same size as Great Britain, just slightly smaller.
Britain - 244,820 sq km
Romania - 237,500 sq km
Poland - 312,685 sq km
<<Oh boy... How many times do I have to say this... Spanish is a Nationality, not a Language! Do you have anmy idea how many languages are spoken in Spain? Go back a few pages, please!
"Spoken Portuguese sounds nothing like Spanish." <<<First off, a spoken Language cannot ever sound like a Nationality! It's a scientific impossibility! Same as a dog not ever being able to sound like a planet!
2nd... Of course Portuguese sounds nothing like CASTILLIAN... Like it doesn't sound like French, Italian, Lianese, Aragonés, Romanian or Catalán! It could sound like Galician, in Northern Portugal, but that is basicly because not 800 years ago, it was the same language... Galaico-Portuguese!!! >>>
I only said that because Portuguese speakers are trying to say that Portuguese in spoken form, sounds more similar to Spanish than Italian does.
As for the Castillian/Spanish comment, everyone outside of Spain usually refer to "Castillian" as "Spanish", as internationally, it is seen as the language of Spain. In Andalucia, they speak standard "Castillian", although they have their own accents. And yes, I am well acquainted with the multiple languages of Spain, some of which are more closely related to Portuguese than they are to Castillian, like Galician.
Most of the Spanish clips sound really lazy, like they don't enunciate. The Andalucian native spoke so fast that I could barely understand a word she said.
And, from what I remember from yesterday, I could only make out a few words the Portuguese speaker said, like Adios. Mainly I just heard a bunch of "sh" "sh" "sh" and nasalization.
"Spoken Portuguese sounds nothing like Spanish." <<<First off, a spoken Language cannot ever sound like a Nationality! It's a scientific impossibility! Same as a dog not ever being able to sound like a planet!
2nd... Of course Portuguese sounds nothing like CASTILLIAN... Like it doesn't sound like French, Italian, Lianese, Aragonés, Romanian or Catalán! It could sound like Galician, in Northern Portugal, but that is basicly because not 800 years ago, it was the same language... Galaico-Portuguese!!! >>>
I only said that because Portuguese speakers are trying to say that Portuguese in spoken form, sounds more similar to Spanish than Italian does.
As for the Castillian/Spanish comment, everyone outside of Spain usually refer to "Castillian" as "Spanish", as internationally, it is seen as the language of Spain. In Andalucia, they speak standard "Castillian", although they have their own accents. And yes, I am well acquainted with the multiple languages of Spain, some of which are more closely related to Portuguese than they are to Castillian, like Galician.
Most of the Spanish clips sound really lazy, like they don't enunciate. The Andalucian native spoke so fast that I could barely understand a word she said.
And, from what I remember from yesterday, I could only make out a few words the Portuguese speaker said, like Adios. Mainly I just heard a bunch of "sh" "sh" "sh" and nasalization.
"WOW! Andalucian Spanish sounded like she didn't even pronounce her words fully! It sounded incredibly different from the Spanish I'm used to. I can see now why some Europeans hold the view they do with regard to Spanish from Spain. Latin American Spanish is much prettier."
I have never heard an Andalucian talk like her, and trust me, I've met alot of Andalucians. They generaly try to exxagerate the accents in these thngs.
And as sombody already said before, there are TONS of dialects in Spain, not just Andalucian. And BTW, most of those clips are NOT very accurate, because in every country there are different dialects for each reagion.... don't tell me ALL mexicans talk like that, because I've heard some horrible noises come out of mexico.
And may I know what "view Europeans hold in regard to Spanish from SPain"?
I have never heard an Andalucian talk like her, and trust me, I've met alot of Andalucians. They generaly try to exxagerate the accents in these thngs.
And as sombody already said before, there are TONS of dialects in Spain, not just Andalucian. And BTW, most of those clips are NOT very accurate, because in every country there are different dialects for each reagion.... don't tell me ALL mexicans talk like that, because I've heard some horrible noises come out of mexico.
And may I know what "view Europeans hold in regard to Spanish from SPain"?
Gringo, you wrote "*castro=celtic village". That's untrue. The word "castro" comes from the Roman word "castrum", meaning "fort", or "fortification". Many placenames in England have a variation of the word "castrum" in them. For example: "Chester", "Winchester", "Chichester", "Lancaster", "Worcester", "Leicester". These are only a few of them.
I, as European, can tell what view Europeans hold in regard to Spanish from Spain...
It's the same as Portuguese from Portugal, German from Germany, Austrian from Austria, Greek from Greece, Italian from Italy, Polish from Poland, Danish from Denmark, Swedish from Sweden, Finn from Finland, etc, etc, etc... Each of this is a citizen of the 25 members of the European Union and simultaneously a European Union citizen!
And NO, there are NOT TONS of dialects in Spain. There are several LANGUAGES (Castillian, Catalán, Galician, Basque, Aragonés, Lianese).
Like in Portugual there are Portuguese and Mirandese.
Concerning "Romania is a big country (about the same size as Poland),
No. It's about the same size as Great Britain, just slightly smaller.
Britain - 244,820 sq km
Romania - 237,500 sq km
Poland - 312,685 sq km"
Britain is a region of France, to start with!
2nd, if you're refering to UK, then you must specify if Occupied Scotland, Occupied Wales and Occupied Ireland are included in those 244,820 sq km
3rd, when I stated Romania is about the same size as Poland, I did it based only on what you can see in any European Map or Atlas, so you immediately get a "size notion", instead of giving exact area measurements, which basicly are abstract to anyone who's not faliliarized with such measurements.
Concerning Portugal being independent only in 1143, this is not true. Portugal proclaimed its independence in 1128, it was some pathetic little guy they called "pope" that only recognised Portugal's independence in 1143, only because Afonso Henriques refused to accept religious interference in matters of State.
And this leads to another curious fact... The Corse Italian born Napoleone Buonaparte was NOT the first to defy religious authority and hornor himself...
1122 Afonso Henriques makes himself Knight in the Zamora Cathedral
1129 Afonso Henriques proclaims hilself Sovereign of all Portuguese Cities and Villages
1140 Afonso Henriques proclaims himself King of Portugal
1143 After a secret political agreement (with the pathetic little guy they called "pope" that followed, in which Afonso Henriques swears obedience to the "pathetic little guy they called "pope""), the pathetic little guy they called "pope" recognises Portugal's Independence and Afonso Henriques as King of Portugal, following by the Treaty of Zamora where Afonso Henriques' cousin Afonso VII of Castilla recognises Afonso Henriques as King of the Kingdom of Portugal as well as with having no vassal duties and/or pay tribute towards/to him!
It is unknown if Afonso Henriques wore the King's Crown at all times, legend says he Crowned himself, off of religious ground in the presence of proheminent Braga clergy.
Braga is the sole Arch-Diocesis in Portugal, since Catholicism reached Portuguese Territory.
There was a clear message, however... Religion is OFF STATE!
I only wish the following sovereigns had kept the same policy!
Cheers!
It's the same as Portuguese from Portugal, German from Germany, Austrian from Austria, Greek from Greece, Italian from Italy, Polish from Poland, Danish from Denmark, Swedish from Sweden, Finn from Finland, etc, etc, etc... Each of this is a citizen of the 25 members of the European Union and simultaneously a European Union citizen!
And NO, there are NOT TONS of dialects in Spain. There are several LANGUAGES (Castillian, Catalán, Galician, Basque, Aragonés, Lianese).
Like in Portugual there are Portuguese and Mirandese.
Concerning "Romania is a big country (about the same size as Poland),
No. It's about the same size as Great Britain, just slightly smaller.
Britain - 244,820 sq km
Romania - 237,500 sq km
Poland - 312,685 sq km"
Britain is a region of France, to start with!
2nd, if you're refering to UK, then you must specify if Occupied Scotland, Occupied Wales and Occupied Ireland are included in those 244,820 sq km
3rd, when I stated Romania is about the same size as Poland, I did it based only on what you can see in any European Map or Atlas, so you immediately get a "size notion", instead of giving exact area measurements, which basicly are abstract to anyone who's not faliliarized with such measurements.
Concerning Portugal being independent only in 1143, this is not true. Portugal proclaimed its independence in 1128, it was some pathetic little guy they called "pope" that only recognised Portugal's independence in 1143, only because Afonso Henriques refused to accept religious interference in matters of State.
And this leads to another curious fact... The Corse Italian born Napoleone Buonaparte was NOT the first to defy religious authority and hornor himself...
1122 Afonso Henriques makes himself Knight in the Zamora Cathedral
1129 Afonso Henriques proclaims hilself Sovereign of all Portuguese Cities and Villages
1140 Afonso Henriques proclaims himself King of Portugal
1143 After a secret political agreement (with the pathetic little guy they called "pope" that followed, in which Afonso Henriques swears obedience to the "pathetic little guy they called "pope""), the pathetic little guy they called "pope" recognises Portugal's Independence and Afonso Henriques as King of Portugal, following by the Treaty of Zamora where Afonso Henriques' cousin Afonso VII of Castilla recognises Afonso Henriques as King of the Kingdom of Portugal as well as with having no vassal duties and/or pay tribute towards/to him!
It is unknown if Afonso Henriques wore the King's Crown at all times, legend says he Crowned himself, off of religious ground in the presence of proheminent Braga clergy.
Braga is the sole Arch-Diocesis in Portugal, since Catholicism reached Portuguese Territory.
There was a clear message, however... Religion is OFF STATE!
I only wish the following sovereigns had kept the same policy!
Cheers!