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Do you like Brazilian Portuguese?
Hhahaha - Miki wrote:
>>>But, to be true, Brazilian Portuguese is different...
if i speak like a ``true gaucho``, perhapes no other portuguese speakers can understand me <<<
More likely most Brazilians will not understand you….
>>>e parem de falar que somos como portugueses, pois que no minimo seja diferente, ainda sim não é somente minha lingua, e sim a do meu rio grande do sul que já é diferente do resto do Brasil em diversos jeitos. =P<<<
Who said you were like the Portuguese?
>>>I`m visiting my mom in netherlands and, to the dutch ears, portuguese and brazilian portuguese are differents
he he he<<<
You mean, just like Dutch is different from Dutch?
“The dialectologist Jo Daan distinguishes between 28 dialects of Dutch. These can be subdivided into six main groups: [...]”
http://www.ned.univie.ac.at/publicaties/taalgeschiedenis/en/dial.htm
http://worldatlas.com/webimage/countrys/europe/nl.htm
Kelly D wrote:
>>>Well, Portuguese movies and soap operas are dubbed (or subtitled) prior to being shown in Brazil. That is: Latin American Spanish is more easily understood by Brazilians than Continental Portuguese. <<<
And Latin American Spanish is not dubbed? Since when? Why is it then that the Brazilian government has to spend millions to teach Spanish as a foreign language?
“No Brasil, segundo dados da OMS, estima-se que existam hoje mais de 2,5 milhões de surdos e cerca de 13 milhões de pessoas portadoras de deficiências auditivas. Os beneficiados pela introdução da legenda oculta na TV representariam, desse modo, um contingente bastante significativo de nossa população.”
“In Brazil, according to data of the OMS, it is esteem that exists today more than 2,5 millions deaf people and about 13 millions with hearing disabilities. The ones that would benefit with the introduction of the occult legend (closed capitation) in the TV would represent, a sufficiently significant contingent of our population.”
http://www.ceara.gov.br/noticias/noticias_detalhes.asp?nCodigoNoticia=9557&sTipoConsulta=mensagemgoverno
“O Centro Cultural Banco do Brasil criou a mostra CINEMA NACIONAL LEGENDADO que vem, desde junho, exibindo uma vez por mês, aos sábados, filmes nacionais legendados em português, no sistema closed caption.[...]
O sistema começou há 20 anos nos EUA e atualmente é usado em diversos países, sendo que no Canadá e EUA ele é aproveitado em quase 100% da programação, beneficiando um público formado por deficientes auditivos, bilingues, semi-analfabetos e crianças em fase de alfabetização.”
“The Cultural Center Banco do Brazil created the sample “NATIONAL CINEMA LEGENDADO” that has been showing since June, once a month on Saturdays, dubbed national films in [Brazilian]Portuguese, with the system closed caption. [... ]
The system started 20 years ago in the U.S.A. and is currently used in several countries, in Canada and U.S.A. it is used in almost 100% of the programs, benefiting a public with hearing disabilities, bilingual viewers, semi-illiterate people and children that are learning to read and write.”
http://cineminha.com.br/noticias.asp?ID=2086
http://www.hcnet.usp.br/otorrino/surd/info.htm
>>>Portuguese people can understand basic Brazilian Portuguese (mostly based on 1000 words soap opera vocabulary) but many of them refuse to read translations of foreign books into Brazilian Portuguese (they like reading in English better, and they say: Brazilians don't know how to translate.<<<
Basic Brazilian Portuguese, that is so funny. Brazilian actors have a vocabulary of a two years old child.
I have seen really messy translations from English to Portuguese, by Brazilians, and this was because the knowledge of the English language was very poor and the Portuguese translation was not of literary quality. Whatever comes from Brazil with good quality is very well accepted in Portugal, we only do not like and do not have to put up with bad translators. The best Brazilian writers, guess what, even get the highest awards of Portuguese language. The Portuguese read their work without any “translation” and that is because their work has quality. Just write like the Brazilians Lygia Fagundes Telles, Jorge Amado, Rachel de Queiroz or João Cabral De Melo Neto and there is no need of “translations”.
http://www.iplb.pt/pls/diplb/!get_page?pnext=404&type=R&code=1654404
>>>I'm not gonna read it. Their grammar is so lousy)...<<<
Many times it is lousy and why do we have to put up with it, why should someone pay to read bad quality writing? Just send quality work. Learn to write like Jorge Amado.
>>>In order not to disturb readers of Continental Portuguese, Paulo Coelho's books are translated from Brazilian Portuguese into Continental Portuguese, spelling, word order, pronouns usage and many phrases being changed(compare with American translation of Harry Potter). Portuguse kids must like Paulo Coelho so much :)<<<
Portuguese kids do not read Paulo Coelho it is not children literature, older people is more likely.
Even Brazilians have a lot to say about his writing:
“Despite all this public success, he is still seen by many critics in Brazil as a lesser author, whose work is too simple and similar to self-help books. Some even call his novels "commercial" and market-oriented. His election to the ABL (Brazilian Academy of Letters) is a very controversial subject among readers in Brazil.”
http://www.reference.com/browse/wiki/Paulo_Coelho
You guys are funny, some of you make such a fuss about a regional variety of Portuguese but when it comes to the native Brazilian languages you do not care if they are forbidden:
“O delegado federal foi incisivo: "ou você fala português ou não fala". A observação era para o índio avá-guarani, líder de um grupo que há dois meses e meio ocupa seu território ancestral, o Parque Nacional do Iguaçu. O líder avá iria determinar a saída dos avás do parque, cumprindo determinação de um juiz federal. O líder avá-guarani não falou. Foi humilhante ver o líder de uma nação que já foi grande ser impedido de falar em seu idioma com seu povo.[...]
Pobres avá- guarani. Primeiro tomamos sua terra. Agora proibimos sua língua."
“The federal agent was incisive: "you either speak Portuguese or you do not speak". The comment was for the indian avá-guarani, leader of a group that for the past two and a half months occupies his ancestral territory, the National Park of Iguaçu. The leader avá would determine the departure of avás from the park, following the determination of a federal judge. The leader avá-guarani did not speak. It was humiliating to see the leader of a nation that had already been great forbidden to speak in his language with his people. [...]
Poor avá-guarani. First we take their lands. Now we forbid their language.”
http://indios.blogspot.com/2005/11/o-av-guarani-o-delegado-federal-e.html
Larissa wrote:
>>>I'd like to know are the differences between Brazilian Portuguese and Portuguese like the differences between American and British English? Or are BrazPortuguese and Portuguese completely different languages? <<<
It is like American and British English.
But you can find lots of American English <-> British English dictionaries on the net to learn some of the differences. This is a funny one:
http://www.effingpot.com/house.shtml
oo thank u so much Alison for your help!
Can't understand why there are so much hatred between Portuguese and Brazilians. C'mon, im portuguese, and i do prefer the brazilian pronounciation, but to say its a different language its ridiculous, and i do have lots of brazilian friends, who came to work in Portugal, and they all say they they didnt felt any language barrier when they first came here. It's shameful, to say Portugal is ..., and Portugal is ..., stop blaming Portugal for something that happened centuries ago.History told us that Spain has tried to invade and claim Portugal lots and lots of time, but i never hated Spain for that, and so as the people i know ( although the older generations somehow dislike spanyards ). And by the way, most of the people from Brazil who come for holidays and so on, are always welcome here, cuz we treat Brazilians like our brothers, and from what i see here, brazilians dont want to be linked to us.Which is curious, cuz when people ask if u are hispanics, most respond no, we are lusiphonics.
Anyway, i hope we can get all along, cuz this hatred between both sides only affects the future of our language. If so, then, Australian, Scottland, Usa,Irland, all have a different language
I am Italobrazilian and I don't like Portugal. Why should Italoamericans like UK, or why should Italobrazilians like Portugal? There are so many Americans with no British blood at all, and there are som many us Brazilians with no Portuguese blood at all. Rubens Barrichello or Gisele Bündchen don't give a damn about Portugal. UK might be ''in vougue'' in the USA, but Portugal is seen as a poor, backward country, where some ugly dialect is Spoken, it's not ''in vogue''.
um baita abraço tupiniquim
a great hug from Brazil
Ok, who cares if u don't like Portugal or not, u like Italy perhaps??? Ok, then, i bet u must be so frustated u weren'tborn in Italy. By the way, i'm Portuguese, and i never shown any sign of superior atittude towards Brazilians, cuz even though we are separated by Atlantic Ocean, i always treat them like equals, and like me most of the Portuguese population.Probably u dont know, but even in Portugal we started using lots of brazilian dialect words in our everyday vocabulary, words like ( cara,legal,galera.etc. ) are now spoken in European portuguese. That's the difference between Spanish and Portuguese, The Spanish although spoken with different pronounciations always remained close together with its variations, while Portuguese is not able to reunite all different dialects.Portugal might be a poor and backyard country, but im proud of it, even though i have spanish ancestry. About Brazilian portuguese being different than portuguese, i dont think so, while i was at university, i had about 4 brazilian teachers with whom we spoke with relatively easy. I might be from a poor country,a backyard like u have said, but at least im more respectful and civilized than u.
The anti-Portuguese attitude seems to be coming from Brazilians with a inferiority complex. They would like to be proud of Brazil but how can they if after nearly 200 years of indepedence, the country is ripped off and raped by their own kind: well, blame it on the Portuguese.
18 billion dollars were illegally transferred in the last 2 years to the USA by just over 500 Brazilians. The Brazilians are wrecking their own country and of course that's because they were once a Portuguese colony?
The Brazilians, who live and work in Portugal have in general no problem adaptating and feel quite at home.
THe 300.000 Portuguese now going to Brazil for their vacation each year
also feel at home there and in general well treated.
The Italian emigrants came to Brazil because their own country in those days was so advanced or maybe also quite backward?
"History told us that Spain has tried to invade and claim Portugal lots and lots of time, but i never hated Spain for that, and so as the people i know ( although the older generations somehow dislike spanyards )."
Es curioso. Yo vivo cerca de la frontera con Portugal y aqui la gente mayor también siente cierto rechazo a los portugueses. La imagen arquetipica que se ha tenido aqui de los portugueses es de los trabajadores temporales gitanos que venian a trabajar en verano y que no siempre tenian una actitud correcta. Por suerte, hoy esa forma de considerar a los portugueses está desapareciendo.
yeah, indeed, the younger generations don't have the i hate spanish atittude nowadays, we embrace spanish music and spanish culture. Nunca he estudiado el español en el colégio, pero créo que me hago entender muy bien entre los españoles. By the way i have an gitano ancestry and a spanish side, so the hispanic culture was always embraced by me, but im still proud of my portuguese roots. Im not saying its best or worst, im just saying its a culture and it should be respected like that, not saying that Portuguese culture sucks and that its invisible to other eyes. If u want to be respected so u should respect others. Like i have said here before, i respect and i do like the Brazilian dialect, if brazilians dont like me, i dont care. And yes,people often say portuguese have an hatred atittude for the spanish people, but thats not true anymore.
I really find many of the Brazilian posters here racist. This is ridiculous. Vanessa why should you DISLIKE Portugal? You don't have to like something, no one is asking you to. What happened to being neutral? Why is it that if you don't like something, you dislike it?
What happened, happened. It's history and I don't understand how anyone can blame the present citizens (who are the ones who made up the country today, not historical figures). It just makes no sense. It's like blaming me for what my great-grandparents did. Or blaming the present-day Germans for Nazi-Germany.
This a historical "feud*" of sorts. While it may have had basis once, it has little credibity now in the present. I wonder if the Brazilian parents over there aren't doing some serious brain-washing.
*Although the feud takes two. I haven't seen any citizens of Portugal espousing such vehemence towards the Brazilians that I see coming from the other side.
Quem diz que a língua falada no Brasil é brasileiro são os próprios portugueses, e por preconceito.
A dificuldade inicial de se falar com um português é simplesmente por problemas de sotaque, afinal, quem não estudou na escola colocação pronominal? Que eu saiba, pronomes oblíquos não são usados em começo de frase. Somos ensinados assim. Mas é regra gramatical, não de uso.
Não estamos habituados a ouvir pessoas com sotaque português todo o tempo. Por isso o estranhamento. E o mesmo ocorre em outros países. Conheço americanos que dizem não compreender os ingleses.
Essa questão das variações dialéticas foi muito discutida nos anos que fiz faculdade de Letras.
Feliz Natal e um bom Reveillon pra todo mundo!
Janina, tu falou muito bem. Eu concordo com tu.
Eu também concordo com a Jan(a?)ína, excepto a frase inicial, que não é confirmada pelas intervenções dos portugueses que participaram neste thread, e só revela mais um preconceito.
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